I'll Probably be banned for this again.... - Page 2

**cmspaz** · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kracka

There is shit hidden within that bill that nobody has even found yet I'm sure.

No doubt.

Whenever they don't release it publicly before the vote, there's always shit nobody wants in there.

**Kracka** · 03-29-2010

Agreed. They are elected officials. The public should be 100% informed on what they are voting on (so should they for that matter). My guess is a lot of people aren't reelected b/c of their YES vote on this bill.

Matt D. · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by MATCHBX

I just hate the fact that you HAVE to carry health insurance now. Not, if you want to, but you HAVE to. And to a certain arbitrary level set by the government. Somehow the government knows my body better than me. And if you don't have it, you will be fined? That's rediculous! I've carried insurance ever since I can remember. And I've used all of about 4 times in my life!! Why should I have to pay for everyone else that goes in for a sniffle?

Just because they say it's a "health care overhaul" doesn't make it good.

It's not just that, it's the fact that the government is forcing the people to buy a commercial product. They are forcing us to spend our money on something whether we like it or not.

Of course, I'm sure Tom will have something to say about how this is good for us.

MATCHBX · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt D.

It's not just that, it's the fact that the government is forcing the people to buy a commercial product. They are forcing us to spend our money on something whether we like it or not.

Of course, I'm sure Tom will have something to say about how this is good for us.

Exactly!! They were mentioning this a while back and someone brought up the fact that they mandate car insurance for cars. Well there is an easy way to opt out of car insurance, don't own a car! We can't opt out of having health insurance because in order to do that, we have to be dead.

I've read some of the original bill. And they intentionally made it very long and full of legal ease to make sure people would not finish reading it. There is a lot of added little extras in there that even the people shouting how much they want this bill passed would scream, WTF!!!

I haven't looked around lately to see if there is anything out there about the new bill. But why pass something and then say that we have to "tweak" it right afterwards? Just to say "we got it passed"? That's stupid. Now that it's passed, they can stall all the "fixes" as long as they want because it is now "law of the land". If it's so important, take the time to get it right first and then present it to the country and see how they feel about it. Not just ram through any piece of legislation and say it needs to get done now because if not now, when. Take the time to get it right!!

Too many people with "entitlement" issues. They feel they are entitled to what everyone else that works hard and makes something of themselves have, but don't need to do anything for it.

**Kracka** · 03-29-2010

Multi-vitamins and fruit are good for me too. When is the government going to start force-feeding us?

1QUICK4 · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by MATCHBX

Too many people with "entitlement" issues. They feel they are entitled to what everyone else that works hard and makes something of themselves have, but don't need to do anything for it.

This

tpunx99GSX · 03-29-2010

The government makes you carry Auto Insurance dont they?

**Kracka** · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by MATCHBX

They were mentioning this a while back and someone brought up the fact that they mandate car insurance for cars. Well there is an easy way to opt out of car insurance, don't own a car! We can't opt out of having health insurance because in order to do that, we have to be dead.

reading > Tom

Matt D. · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by tpunx99GSX

The government makes you carry Auto Insurance dont they?

Are you serious? It's a state by state law, not a federal government mandate. And they don't tell you who you can or can be insured by, or to what level, just so much as you have it. And it's not just to protect you (which is what health care is for, right?) but to protect anything and anyone else.

**Kracka** · 03-29-2010

You must also remember that the government doesn't require people to keep auto insurance coverage on their car or person, only to cover damage to another person's car or well-being.

1QUICK4 · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by tpunx99GSX

The government makes you carry Auto Insurance dont they?

Yes, but if you don't drive, it is not required.

How would you feel if you didn't own a car or have a DL. You rode the bus every day.

Then the Guberment stepped in and required you to buy their auto insurance. (even though you don't own or need a car) As well as help pay for other peoples car insurance that could afford a car but not insurance.

MATCHBX · 03-29-2010

http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/Se...in;contentBody

There is the 2400+ pages of the original bill.

And here is a summary of the bill.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...46-503544.html

There are a lot of points in the summary that are really scary. One to note is the excise taxes.

"Excise Tax -- Beginning in 2018, insurance companies will pay a 40 percent excise tax on so-called "Cadillac" high-end insurance plans worth over $27,500 for families ($10,200 for individuals). Dental and vision plans are exempt and will not be counted in the total cost of a family's plan."

So if I want the absolute best coverage for my family AND want to pay for it out of my pocket, that insurance company is gonna get hit with a 40% tax on what they get from it? Talk about running the competition out of town!

You really gotta dig into what they have passed as "LAW" now!! And you wonder why people are in such an uproar. Granted insurance companies have been making alot of money. But to put government in as competition for them is not the way to get them to stop any bad practices. If you don't like how an insurance company does business, change companies. How do you tell a business you don't like their product? You buy someone elses!!

Nightjoker7 · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by tpunx99GSX

The government makes you carry Auto Insurance dont they?

WTF are you really gonna use that as a example????? Use your brain.

**Kracka** · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightjoker7

Use your brain.

Easier to ask Obama to do it for him.

FattyBoomBatty · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1QUICK4

Yes, but if you don't drive, it is not required.

How would you feel if you didn't own a car or have a DL. You rode the bus every day.

Then the Guberment stepped in and required you to buy their auto insurance. (even though you don't own or need a car) As well as help pay for other peoples car insurance that could afford a car but not insurance.

Invalid. You can't stop living the same way you can stop owning a car. But come to think of it, if you really don't want to have health insurance and stay in the U.S., you can always off yourself and be buried in the states.

And as for "sneaking" bills in before voting time, it's not like it hasn't happened before. Bush and Dick did the same with the Patriot Act, one of the most privacy-invading bills of all time. And as a republican, you can be proud of your representatives for holding hands and refusing to vote yes on the bill. They did everything they could, but after eight years of bush and cheney, the people really needed change (I'm not riding the slogan bandwagon with that one either) and they proved it by voting in more democrats than republicans, and now look what happened. They started flexing on the minorities. Not a far cry for any majority group whether it's in politics or not.

FattyBoomBatty · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by MATCHBX

http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/Se...in;contentBody

There is the 2400+ pages of the original bill.

And here is a summary of the bill.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...46-503544.html

There are a lot of points in the summary that are really scary. One to note is the excise taxes.

"Excise Tax -- Beginning in 2018, insurance companies will pay a 40 percent excise tax on so-called "Cadillac" high-end insurance plans worth over $27,500 for families ($10,200 for individuals). Dental and vision plans are exempt and will not be counted in the total cost of a family's plan."

So if I want the absolute best coverage for my family AND want to pay for it out of my pocket, that insurance company is gonna get hit with a 40% tax on what they get from it? Talk about running the competition out of town!

You really gotta dig into what they have passed as "LAW" now!! And you wonder why people are in such an uproar. Granted insurance companies have been making alot of money. But to put government in as competition for them is not the way to get them to stop any bad practices. If you don't like how an insurance company does business, change companies. How do you tell a business you don't like their product? You buy someone elses!!

I don't know about that, if anything it just introduces economies of greater scale, which has never hurt anybody except the ones making the shittiest product. When there is more competition, there is usually a better product or process that results, have you not noticed this in any part of your life?

MATCHBX · 03-29-2010

The biggest thing is that this policy is hitting everyone in the pocketbook no matter who you are. It is also rewarding laziness and punishing those who work to better themselves. Why should I work hard to get the money to afford a very comfortable living only for the government to come and take more taxes out of my pocket to pay for someone else that doesn't want to earn their own way?

And it is against pretty much everything this country was founded on. Freedom of choice will not exist much longer. You will have to do what they want you to whether you like it or not.

MATCHBX · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by FattyBoomBatty

I don't know about that, if anything it just introduces economies of greater scale, which has never hurt anybody except the ones making the shittiest product. When there is more competition, there is usually a better product or process that results, have you not noticed this in any part of your life?

Free market competition is much different than government competition. Government is not there to make a profit. Nor should they. Plus, where does government get their money in the first place?

FattyBoomBatty · 03-29-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by MATCHBX

Plus, where does government get their money in the first place?

Selling parcels of land and stealing Mayan Gold.

2zzgtte · 03-29-2010

My problem is that I don't want to have to pay for someone else's problems. I think everyone should pay for their own problems.

This will, undoubtedly, put the US in so much MORE debt that we will be out of a world power for minimum of 10 years I'm sure. Now, if China starts selling our T-bills because they assume we cannot pay our bills, we are in a serious situation. "The Situation" cannot even help us out of this one...