Shooting at Fort Hood, TX - Page 4

**Kracka** · 11-12-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by A//// Guy

Then why did you guys say they shouldn't be allowed in the military?

As a precaution against the ones who are the extremists. Fair? Not at all, but when a country is at war sometimes you need to take precautions in order to protect the military and citizens. As mentioned earlier in this thread its getting increasingly difficult to determine friend from foe and no matter what actions we take people are going to get hurt and upset, but in my mind this is the lesser of two evils. We're all free to express our own opinions on the matter, but the personal insults and name-calling needs to stop now.

**1ViciousGSX** · 11-12-2009

OK, let me clarify a few things:

RLFebo is banned for good reason. I, nor will any Admin here allow a personal attack on one, any, or all members of this forum for any reason. I don't care if you disagree 100% with a discussion, people (that includes you & me) are entitled to their opinions and should be allowed to say or post them without that type of outburst. As long as I've been a member of this site (which goes back to when it all started originally) it has been an open/free speech forum that allows personal expression pretty much unchecked. But we do have limits.

Do I believe Muslims should be allowed into the military, sure I do, especially if they were born and raised here. And that also comes with an understanding that anybody (not just a Muslim) can enlist for the purpose of hurting our military efforts to help the enemy. Why should we automatically trust that someone who is not a U.S. citizen would 100% be with us instead of trying to hurt us. Just seems too risky for me to allow foreigners into the military for that one reason.

I know that all Muslims are not terrorist or the enemy (and I'm sure most on this forum feel the same way), but there is no clear marker that distinguishes the honest, hard working peaceful Muslims from the ones that want to do what this guy did until it's too late. But in this case the markers were there which makes it that much worse.

Everybody needs to take a deep breath, relax a little here and understand that at a time of war, some things we don't like or think are wrong, happen for the right reason, which is protecting innocent lives and this country.

**Kracka** · 11-12-2009

Both is the answer to your question. Humans are violent by nature and religion just gives us a reason to hate.

**scheides** · 11-12-2009

Everyone read this!

So, um...yea. This is a car forum. I understand people are passionate about this, but seriously, you guys all need to calm down. If you are replying to an open-ended statement that someone made, no matter how thought-provoking it is, just remember: this is the Internet! This forum is here for collaboration, learning, and FUN and if you aren't here for that, then GTFO!

This is my first and last post in this thread, carry on.

A//// Guy · 11-12-2009

Ive always wondered what the magical Scheides thought about political topics. haha

**Kracka** · 11-12-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by A//// Guy

Ive always wondered what the magical Scheides thought about political topics. haha

LOL he is smart and stays out of them.

**Halon** · 11-13-2009

Dumb question:

How many of those suggesting how the military be ran (exclude certain groups), have actually served in the military, and served with someone that falls into one of these groups that should be excluded?
It's a horrible thing what happened there, lots of innocent lives were taken for no reason. But this event was done by extremeists, and to punish an entire culture based on the events done by extremists, is not right and very much not 'American' (in my opinion, which everyone has their own). I personally can't think of a more honorable and noble approach of trying to earn your citizenship into this country, than by putting your own life on the line for it.

Can I make a poor attempt at making a comparison? Did an innocent life not get taken this summer by someone from the "SC crowd" (sorry couldn't think of a better word) out on University this year late at night? I'm sure the Police in some way feel they're at 'war' with "street-racers" specifically the SC crowd (don't tell me none of you have ever felt like the cops watch you a little closer because of your car). How would you feel if they came down and put sanctions on anyone driving anything that could be lumped into that same crowd, because it's "your people" who are the problem? It's the lesser of the two evils as you put it is it not? So a lot of people get upset because they have now put a sanction on driving anything they consider a SC after dusk, but maybe we saved a life here and there... This is supposed to be a free country. That doesn't mean free to do whatever you want, but free to do what you aught to do and what is right. And what we aught to do and what is right, is to not judge others "by the color of their skin (or religion), but by the content of their character." Again, in my opinion, the day we start excluding groups based on these, is the day this country took a major step backwards.

Don't get me wrong, what happened was horrible, and they obviouslly dropped the ball on this soldier. But to punish an entire group (how many millions of people are we talking here) based on the actions of extremists, in my opinion is wrong. And it doesn't make what happened in Texas right. This guy was obviouslly one of the bad ones who slipped through the cracks somehow, and I hope he gets what he deserves.

OK that's my comment on the whole matter. I'm sure my comments will be picked out one by one by someone and ripped apart, and that's fine because everyone has their opinion. This one is simply mine.

Hasta Luego Muchachos.

**goodhart** · 11-13-2009

^^^ I agree 100%.

A//// Guy · 11-13-2009

Totally agree with brandon, and his comparison is pretty good.

**Kracka** · 11-13-2009

The cops do put sanctions on us down on University in the way of getting pulled over constantly for BS reasons. Like it or not injustice is a way of life.

**1ViciousGSX** · 11-13-2009

To what was said above ^^^.

I'll use your analogy:
We all know the cops look at our cars and lump us into that "group". Why? Because we as a group earned that reputation, plain and simple. If the idiots among us weren't out there running a 1/4 mile between every stop light, or drifting every corner they come to, etc., maybe the police wouldn't have a reason to do what they do to us on a daily basis. It's funny, but everybody who knows me in my home town will tell you I never street race, period. I know people who do and it's their choice to do so. I don't think it's safe and if I took an innocent life over something that stupid I wouldn't be able to live with myself.

So what has happened to lessen our issues with the police, we started policing ourselves. Stopped the street racing and stupid crap to get them off our backs. If somebody gets stupid in a parking lot with their car, we have asked them to leave or run them off. Now the police don't seemed too bothered by us so much anymore. Sure, I still get the look from cops at times, but I don't get harassed.

One thing nobody has brought up yet, but I think is a very good point. What about the men and women who serve beside the Muslim soldiers? How are they handling it? Are they wondering if they should be keeping an eye on the enemy and the Muslims serving with them? Me, I would have that in the back of my mind the whole time I would be fighting along side of them, wondering when I might become their target.

I'll say it again, I'm not a racist or bigot as others have said or implied in this thread, but I am realist, and the reality is that the Muslim community has a problem with how the few are making the many look. Maybe the Muslim community should start policing itself and get rid of the radicals and their radical beliefs towards the white man. That might go a long way with lifting the "stigma" they have at the moment.

**Halon** · 11-13-2009

And I will ask one more time...

Who here that is making comments on how the military is ran, has actually even been in the military making them able to make a knowledgable statement based on personal experience?

I'm done...

**Kracka** · 11-13-2009

The great part about America is that those of us who never were in the military are still able to form and express an opinion. The sames goes for every single person who has posted in this thread.

**goodhart** · 11-14-2009

^^^ Yes, but everything in the military has a process. It's not just about making an opinion, its knowing how things operate in the military and knowing that the military operates much different from any other civilian business, corporation, etc. If the military DID actually stop allowing muslims to enlist, the process would take years and years of different hoops to jump through, not to mention it would take a huge majority of politicians just to get the ball rolling.

TheBlizzard · 11-14-2009

You don't have to be in the military to have an opinion on who should be allowed in or not, it seems as if there is a huge variety of opinions, both from current/X military and from ones who have never been in at all.

I have not been in the military and do not 100% know the process, therefore I would not speak of something that I do not know about, however, my opinion still stands; I really think due to the current state of our country we need to be more careful about who we let fight for our country.

And if there are signs of someone posing a potential threat to our country and it's soldiers they need to be detained and questioned; no matter their race or religious background. There are just too many politics involved in situations like what just happened, which is why this guy wasn't stopped. Nobody wanted to be the person who called out a "Muslim" for suspicious activity, because if they were wrong the repercussions would be too harsh.

**Halon** · 11-15-2009

Absolutely correct. That is part of America. You can have zero first hand experience with anything, zero knowledge about anythign, yet you still have the right to have your opinion, and also express it.

I'm going to express my opinion now. Spanish food fuckin blows and I need to come home and have some Outback or something good. Although Spain does have the best Ham (jamon) in the world, but a man can only eat so much of that over 5 weeks.

**1ViciousGSX** · 11-15-2009

Halon, just because I and others haven't been in the military doesn't mean we can't use common sense about the issue and say that the liberal way about things is 100% the right way to go about it, because it's not the right way to go about doing it. I assume you are in the military? If so, then tell us how the United States military, the FBI and your fellow soldiers can justify knowing about this guy (his beliefs and actions) and not do or say anything about him? If you are in the military, how do you feel knowing that 12 of your fellow soldiers were gunned down and 30+ others injured by this extremist (who was one of your brothers in arms) while stationed at a home base where you should feel the safest? I don't think any of them ever expected to be shot and/or killed by one of your/their own.

I'm glad to see that everybody has taken a little breath and calmed down in this thread. I hate politics as much as the next guy/gal, but we all have to respect each others opinions, even as much as we might disagree on them.

Mntc · 11-15-2009

I knew the guy from mn that was there went to school with him pretty sad left behind 3 kids and a wife

tpunx99GSX · 11-16-2009

Project2g, i still am waiting for a call from your recruiter, so that i can tell them you like men, then they will kick you out. They still dont allow gays right?

Maybe ill tell them you lied and your a woman.... THEY ALLOW WOMEN NOW????

What the hell is the military coming to. I thought they were only allowed to admit blonde haired blue eyed white men with german descent?

All joking aside, I loved the comment about only muslims go to war over religion. Like chistianity has no blood on its hands. Erase religion and live in peace. Peace be with you, and also with you... lol

**scheides** · 01-08-2010