Cheap Fmic's

**Kracka** · 12-15-2003

If anyone is interested, AHP has his 1G and 2G Stage 2 FMIC kits on sale for a very good price ($695).

click here fool

**Halon** · 12-15-2003

talk about LONG route piping!!

**Kracka** · 12-15-2003

Yes, he designed both for ease of installation. The 1G piping routes through the stock location similar to the Apexi and GReddy 2G kits. On the 2G kit, the inlet pipe runs around the driver's side of the radiator, and the outlet runs through the stock location. Archer is an AHP vendor and has his 2G kit on one of their shop cars and it looks VERY nice.

PSI2HI · 12-15-2003

We're gonna be having our own kits for the 1G's here real soon. Just trying to get the end tanks finished up. They are going to be using a 24x12 core and short route piping just as the street/race cores do. Gonna be shooting for the $750-800 range complete w/ everything needed for install.

Nick

**Halon** · 12-16-2003

that sounds like a pretty good deal. The AHP one i noticed too seems kinda small. I'd want 24" long at the least. I think his are like 20" long. Also I don't like his endtanks. The design seems wierd, like how it comes into the intercooler on the left then goes thru and has to do UP and out of the driver side endtank. Also i don't like how noticable the welds are on his endtanks. In a way it sorta looks sloppy. And lastly, i dunno how it works for you guys since u could just drive there, but i had ordered a catback from him shipped to Arizona, and it took me about 6 months to receive it. Talk about a major pain in the ass. But i do agree that he has put a nice sale price tag on em!

A//// Guy · 12-16-2003

Unless you are pushing 600-800 horses you will never reach teh potential of using all of the 24 inches.... an 8x16 suits almost all dsm needs. Some people think its always bigger the better. The bigger you get the less efficient it is.

**JET** · 12-16-2003

Actually the efficiency will go up. The psi drop will go up slightly (all else being equal) and the amount of lag will go up too. Not to mention the extra weight and installation becoming more difficult along with a higher cost. The downside is small to a larger intercooler, except for the cost. There is, of course, a point of diminishing returns.

1QUICK4 · 12-16-2003

Do you guys thin one of those 1G stage II's will support about 450WHP? (60 trim)

A//// Guy · 12-16-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by JET@Dec 16 2003, 07:55 PM
Actually the efficiency will go up. The psi drop will go up slightly (all else being equal) and the amount of lag will go up too. Not to mention the extra weight and installation becoming more difficult along with a higher cost. The downside is small to a larger intercooler, except for the cost. There is, of course, a point of diminishing returns.

Yea your right I meant power efficiency. Pressure drop etc. you will get much more power if there is less pressure drop, therefor if you have a "sweet huge" core and are making only 300 horses your actually not even making the power you could be with a "ratio sized core."
But then again if you by a small one then you have to upgrade like Jet said. How many people actually get up to 800 horses anyway

**JET** · 12-16-2003

It should do that fine. I don't like the piping though. The SLS is much better as far as piping goes. It will cause more lag, psi drop and weight. It is a decent price though and far superior to the SMIC. You also get to deal with AHP's infamous customer service and delivery times.

**Halon** · 12-16-2003

i don't see how ur lag will go up. With all that piping that you have to fill with that AHP kit vs. like an IRC kit with a bigger core with very short piping. there is much more volume to fill up in ahp's kit vs. a kit that includes even a 28" core. If i'm totally wrong then let me know, but look at how much piping is used in his kit vs. this one from slow boy racing.

that core from slowboy is 24x3.5x12 its a bigger core yet the piping is so much shorter. much less volume to fill. i guess u guys be the judge, but that's my opinion.

A//// Guy · 12-16-2003

Yea the long piping is not good but thats for people who just want a stock looking IC pipe and for simple instalation. Also the end tanks on the slowboy IC suck... the air is going to get trapped in the corner and the flow is going to be really poor. The ahp core with entanks will flow alot better, less pressure drop. So as far as performace they should equal out... I would think.

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 12-16-2003

The Slowboy Racing core has to be the ugliest endtank design I have ever seen though in terms of looks and flow.

Nash · 12-16-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by ecoli@Dec 16 2003, 09:08 PM
The Slowboy Racing core has to be the ugliest endtank design I have ever seen though in terms of looks and flow.

Unless you have a re-welded Victory Perfomance one, cause those are the ugliest.

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 12-16-2003

Quote:

Do you guys thin one of those 1G stage II's will support about 450WHP? (60 trim)

It will. We made 410whp on a stupid Supra sidemount and Tyler with the non-VTEC LS (1.9liter 8.8:1 compression, power curve looks like a DSM) made 400whp on a tiny 20"x6"x2.25" core, but it definately would have been easier with a larger core and you have less chance of heatsoaking by the time you get to 4th gear. I would get the SLS kit. Good size core, their piping is short, thick flanges, and the best powdercoating I have ever gotten on a part.

ACRucrazy · 12-16-2003

Im still learning, and maybe this doesnt apply directly to DSMs..BUT....

One of the SRTforums members put a Perrin FMIC on his car, and the owner as well as many people were concerned on what affects it would have on his relativly stock car.

He put it on thinking there would be some turbolag, but his SOTP dyno told him no!
He went to the dyno and on lower than stock boost settings, about 13psi, he gained 16whp. Sure thats alot of money now to gain 16hp, but he did it with less boost. And when he gets the mods he wants, and cranks the boost up, im sure that larger FMIC will prove even more effective!
Heres his quote
"Bone stock:14psi-12psi at redline
211whp 239tq

Then I added:14psi-12psi to redline
VRS 3"exhaust+dp w/ cat and AEM intake
224.4hp 254.2wtq

Day before yesterday:
VRS 3" exhaust+dp w/racepipe/AEM intake/ Unorthodox UDP/ SPP 02 housing/ Rage WGA set at 14.5psi-13psi at redline
244.7whp 267.7wtq

Today:
w/ PerrinFMIC installed
VRS 3" exhaust+dp w/racepipe/AEM intake/ Unorthodox UDP/ SPP 02 housing/ Rage WGA set at 14.5psi-13psi at redline
260.7whp 279.5wtq

I picked up a total 16whp by bolting on the PerrinFMIC at the same boost level. I also picked up 13wtq and larger gains through the power band. Almost identical temps and humidity levels as 2 days prior to todays dyno. Basically we made 4 pulls. All of them were within 1-3hp of eachother. All pulls were made back to back with about 1-2min apart from eachother.

What the dyno is actually telling me is that the car is making more power, more consistently. With the stock IC dyno's done back to back the hp would drop. The car had very little cool down time from the 30 min drive to LUJAN motorsports. Bottom line is the intercooler makes power. Good power. My AFR's were 12.1-12.2. I am also still using the stock computer and injectors.

My suspicions were correct. When I took off the stock intercooler yesterday, it was so light. You want your intercooler to have some mass to it. I was sitting there by myself doing the install and saying, no wonder stage2 is coming w/ an intercooler water sprayer. Dynamicsrturbo(pablo) of Lujan was stunned. Willie was thinking I was going to lose power. Heck, I thought I might lose a little to. Imagine our suprise when it layed down more power. I told Willie to do another run right away and it cam back 260 as well. The third run came back at 258whp. After that, I said"ok, it's a wrap!" I want to thank everyone for their little bits of advice here and there.

Keep in mind the car is only pushing 13psi!! Imagine if I had more fuel and was able to see 17-18psi what the gains would be. Nothing outrageous but I would imagine 20-25whp gains would be easily attainable. Ok, just passing along information."

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 12-16-2003

Lame ass STD correction!

BTW, we gained 10-15whp at 17psi when Tyler upgraded to a larger FMIC core on his LS. We haven't dynoed it on race gas yet.

**Halon** · 12-16-2003

that is an extremely common end tank design for 1g's. Slowboy, ExtremePSI, RnR, Buschur, and Indy Race Core are ones i can name just off the top of my head real quick that use that design. I think it is probably the most commonly used endtank design on 1g intercooler kits.

**Shane@DBPerformance** · 12-16-2003

The Buschur, IRC, ExtremePSI, and VPE ones are not like that. They use the perpendicular inlet/outlets, but the endtanks are not quite like those things.

**Goat Blower** · 12-16-2003

I'd much rather have a big core and short piping than a tiny core and long piping. Pressure drop isn't really an issue unless you're running a stock turbo where every psi counts. Most turbos will just spin a hair faster to make the same boost with a larger volume between the turbo and TB. And I still don't get why companies make a FMIC that routes piping through the stock location. You have to take everything apart to get it on anyways, why not notch out the two holes to route short piping through? Easier to install, my ass. :liar: