Potential Buy 1997 GSX - Page 10

SlowWhite · 06-12-2014

Logs from last night posted. More rain/thundershowers today so no work done other then going to the store to get a spark plug gap ring, correct socket, and stuff for a coolant flush.

I remembered today that I had taken the cop out to check the spark plugs just prior to the car dieing regularly. And was wondering should I have put dielectric grease or what ever its called on the plugs?

I am planning on stopping back at the auto parts store tomorrow to see of they have some. Some of what I read about cop setups say it helps a lot.

I also noticed last night that the car would stay in I believe its called "open loop... .80" for ever before going back to "closed loop" car ran great in open loop. But as soon as it went to "closed" is when id have the hesitation or fuel issues.

Any rate that's all the update for now.

turbotalon1g · 06-12-2014

open loop vs closed loop is WOT tables vs cruise tables. I'm not sure which one is which I always confuse them when talking about it.

But once you go past a certain throttle % at a certain load point and RPM it will target your direct access table values.

**asshanson** · 06-12-2014

Open loop disregards the oxygen sensor and goes off the table values (for high throttle, first bit after starting the car, etc).
Closed loop is using o2 feedback to make the AFR more rich or more lean. If it's consistently lean or rich, this will turn into a long term fuel trim adjustment.

If it's only running like crap in closed loop, take a look at the long and short term fuel trim and o2 volts, maybe your sensor is going out. Did you say you have a wideband simulating a narrowband?

SlowWhite · 06-12-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by asshanson

Open loop disregards the oxygen sensor and goes off the table values (for high throttle, first bit after starting the car, etc).
Closed loop is using o2 feedback to make the AFR more rich or more lean. If it's consistently lean or rich, this will turn into a long term fuel trim adjustment.

If it's only running like crap in closed loop, take a look at the long and short term fuel trim and o2 volts, maybe your sensor is going out. Did you say you have a wideband simulating a narrowband?

I dont have my laptop with me but memory serves me yes its using the "wideband simulating narrowband" I believe that box is checked.
And which ever loop it is. The one when you go wot.... itll stay in that loop for ever. Last night ot stayed in the loop for probably 5min of normal cruising after I did a light pull. And actually it would go back into the wot loop even if I was still cruising.

I posted that whole log from startup till I got home on ecmlink. Its my last post on that thread.

dsmghost · 06-12-2014

If your car intermittently gets stuck in open loop you have a problem. If you haven't already done so, post a log of it happening. It's likely one of your sensors causing the issue. You mentioned when it does go in closed loop it runs bad, which also likely points a feedback sensor issue.

I feel bad for your situation, no offense. Nobody around to help, lots of problems, and many threads asking for help about countless problems. Somebody gives you good advice or helps solve a problem, then your onto the next issue without resolving any prior issues it seems. Not trying to be a dick, keep asking questions, but work on one thing at a time and stop daily driving your car if you are until it's all straightened out.

SlowWhite · 06-12-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsmghost

If your car intermittently gets stuck in open loop you have a problem. If you haven't already done so, post a log of it happening. It's likely one of your sensors causing the issue. You mentioned when it does go in closed loop it runs bad, which also likely points a feedback sensor issue.

I feel bad for your situation, no offense. Nobody around to help, lots of problems, and many threads asking for help about countless problems. Somebody gives you good advice or helps solve a problem, then your onto the next issue without resolving any prior issues it seems. Not trying to be a dick, keep asking questions, but work on one thing at a time and stop daily driving your car if you are until it's all straightened out.

That's exactly what I told the wife after last night. I won't be taking it to work anymore, just isnt safe/reliable until i get these issues straight.

Also i posted logs from each day. From when in first started having issues all the way till yesterdays logs which had every issue all rolled into one long log.

SlowWhite · 06-13-2014

well went out today and changed plugs, checked oil, checked coolant. Oil level is good coolant level is good and onto the plugs, the plugs that were a nice grey color a few days ago when i checked are now completely black, and the gapping on all of them was at .22

I gapped the new plugs to .28 then noticed the oil catch can had a little mist of oil below the filter so i drained the catch can and noticed two things. First thing to come out was what i assume is water mixed with oil. To describe the amount of what ever this is before the oil started coming out. Is about 5 shot glasses worth, then oil started coming out. (there was enough oil in it to fill a standard size glass 3/4 of the way full) I dont know when the last time he emptied it so I cant say how long it took for that to fill up like that.

anyrate i then started the car turned on the log, let the car warm up completely, checked for any smoke coming out the exhaust or fluid, used a paper towel and noticed a black soot getting caught on the towel. Inside the exhaust tip is as black as the spark plugs. (i took pictures on my phone if you want me to upload the spark plug colors from a few days ago as well as them today) then I went for a quick drive, after pulling to the end of the driveway the car went into I believe "closed loop"... what ever setting it is after a wot pull only i never went WOT simply reversed out of the driveway.

And it died at the 2nd stop sign, so i adjusted the mafcomp a little bit and it didnt die again. However it would go in and out of this closed loop the entire trip.

Im about to put the log up on ecmlink. would the set up on the laptop cause this to not go into open loop? or is it more likely the wideband sensor going bad.

I was going to pull that and see what it looked like tomorrow as I have to get ready for work.

**Kracka** · 06-13-2014

Are there no professional tuners around you? I'm sure you've mentioned it already, I probably just missed it.

**Halon** · 06-13-2014

Understanding open loop vs. closed loop generically is pretty simple. It simply is referring to the ECU feedback loop (feedback being the O2 signal) either being open or closed.

Open Loop = No O2 feedback, the feedback loop is open/broken/not-in-use.
Closed Loop = O2 feedback, the feedback loop is now closed/in-use.

Stock narrowbands are calibrated to read stoich (14.7). So closed loop operation would be scenarios where you expect to be at 14.7. This would be idle, cruising, low load scenarios.

Open Loop would be when you don't want to be at 14.7, so you just hard set your tables to put you at say 11.5. So open loop would be scenarios you don't want to be at 14.7 and you want to be at something else. So WOT, heavy throttle, high load, cold start/warm up kind of scenarios. Times when you're running at 11.5 and the O2 is feeding back to the ECU saying "Hey your not stoich", the ECU says I don't care I don't want to be stoich right now so I'm ignoring your feedback.

Open and closed both use fuel tables. Closed loop just has the added benefit of O2 feedback so if for some reason your table doesn't put you right at that perfect stoich mixture, the ECU can detect that it's not stoich and can compensate based on that feedback.

SlowWhite · 06-13-2014

Ah so I have the termonology backwards.

Also is anyone viewing the logs im posted? My question is I know you can set up how and when the car switches between loops manually in the ecmlink software. (I read that when reading about doing cruise/closed loop logs) so maybe that is set wrong?

The other is would a faulty o2 sensor be a possible/likely cause of this (as I believe the wideband o2 is the only o2 on the car.

SlowWhite · 06-13-2014

As far as I know...no. at least I dont know of any with link experience. hensenmy comments earlier that if i cant get tuning figured out i might see about flying someone in if i can find an awd dyno.

There are a few supra places with in 5hr dr but that's all I know about and that still doesnt help with link knowledgability.

I do know of one guy in atlanta running speed density (car I was looking at) who said he did his own tuning.
And his car is pushing 68lbs/min.

Maybe I can talk shane into doing it long distance via sending him logs or something.

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kracka

Are there no professional tuners around you? I'm sure you've mentioned it already, I probably just missed it.

**goodhart** · 06-14-2014

A quick google search got me this: http://forums.evolutionm.net/southea...-carolina.html

Here's some DSM/Evo capable shops in your relative area:

134 miles awayForce-Fed Performance

131 miles away HIS Motorsports

87 miles away Six Sigma Dyno Services

134 miles away Spec Ops Motorsports (Their facebook is better than the website)

Enjoy

Fejery4491 · 06-14-2014

How did we even survive prior to google?

tehehodi · 06-14-2014

So, did you buy this?

SlowWhite · 06-14-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodhart

A quick google search got me this: http://forums.evolutionm.net/southea...-carolina.html

Here's some DSM/Evo capable shops in your relative area:

134 miles awayForce-Fed Performance

131 miles away HIS Motorsports

87 miles away Six Sigma Dyno Services

134 miles away Spec Ops Motorsports (Their facebook is better than the website)

Enjoy

nice at least they have awd dyno's and evos pictured. will be sending emails / phone calls when im ready to hit them up if they are ecmlink experienced.

SlowWhite · 06-14-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fejery4491

How did we even survive prior to google?

lol - remember most of the time im on my phone and its a piece of shit.

when i go to "search" on any forum while on it , it just then takes me to the web address bar. So search features dont work AT ALL on my phone.

And using "quote's" while making posts is beyond frustrating. The curser will randomly jump around and if I'm typing a long post it wont let me scroll through my posts it just scrolls the full thread so i basically have to start over retyping my post.

But google does work I just never actually did a search for dyno's, yet as im still working on the rest of my problems before i spend the money to get it tuned. I did make a post on ecmlink looking for a tuner / dyno but that's as far as i got when all this other crap started.

I appreciate all your guys help. I would have done search's once the car was IMO ready for a dyno (I even made that comment earlier, the car isnt ready)

its going to be at least till middle of July before i'll even have the funds to purchase the replacement items I want to try to fix the car. And the $300-500 dyno fund wont be till Aug/sept if at the earliest.

Let alone no matter where this dyno is i will have to be able to drive the car there and as it sits now i cant even drive to out of the neighborhood with out it stalling atm.

I have a guy on link working on a tune for me (started late last night). Im pretty sure my wideband is toast (stayed in open loop all morning when i was doing the "idle" log for him. So looks like july will be the earliest replacement for that and I can start again, unless it staying in open look is something hes doing on his end? I havent done anything but load his files and do what he's asking)

SlowWhite · 06-14-2014

Anyrate. I have a list of things I want to add to the car before i pay for dyno time weather its to fix an issue or just as part of my plans for the car.

Mostly cooling system fixes.
-xline radiator
-mishimoto fan shroud with fans
-mishimoto lower thermostat
-mishimoto 1.3 radiator cap
-mishimoto sandwich adapter for oil filter housing
-map oil cooler
-aem oil pressure gauge
-aem oil Temp gauge (maybe)
-aem uego sensor replacement

If those those things dont keep coolant temps below 200. Then ill look into installing all the heater stuff. As to make life easier I'd probably pull the engine at that point. And would probably wait till taxes and just have the car painted since I'd be pulling the interior out and motor.

Been debating on keeping car red or doing a full white make over, interior metal and all would get painted white.

TkrPerformance · 06-14-2014

Why?
-mishimoto sandwich adapter for oil filter housing
If it's a 7bolt. Get evo 1-3 ofh (I have one around) or evo 8-9 ofh all will bolt on and will not need a sandwich adapter to run an oil cooler set up.

SlowWhite · 06-14-2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by TkrPerformance

Why?
-mishimoto sandwich adapter for oil filter housing
If it's a 7bolt. Get evo 1-3 ofh (I have one around) or evo 8-9 ofh all will bolt on and will not need a sandwich adapter to run an oil cooler set up.

When the time comes I was going to go through everything with one of maps reps to make sure im getting the right stuff as well as everything I need to install.

I originally wanted the sandwich plate for the oil sensors. But now that im looking to get an oil cooler....

The car has a forward facing oil filter housing. Which I have not researched yet as to where it came from (make model car etc) so I was going to go over it with there rep to see that I have everything I need to install everything correctly.

But again this is a little while off. I may even do this in stages just all depends on cash flow. Amd things that come with having 3 kids and a wife. I dont need this car so I can take as long as I want to get things done.

Also the car has a 6 bolt in it

SlowWhite · 06-15-2014

Well having a great fathers day.

Jery1234 on ecmlink forums has spend yesterday and today. Tuning my car. And I must say its running great so far. We just started working on WOT pulls. All logs requested have been posted on my ecmlink thread (see earlier post for link if need be)