Extremely bad experience with Kath...

Raptor · 04-05-2005

Well with the couple questions recently on where to get a flywheel machined and peoples experience with Kath Auto Parts on Rice in St Paul, I figured this would be pretty good info. We have had several flywheels turned by them and all were decent and at the .610 step we requested until recently. They missed considerably, by .017" to be exact. I won't go into detail the great amount of money this wasted for me but suffice it to say the overnight shipping on the clutch was a waste as well as a lot of late night labor. At any rate, what really pisses me off about the whole thing is the way they handled it after the fact. I go back up there to express my extreme dissatisfaction and maybe get an apology, possibly a credit for the work etc, what I get are a bunch of rediculous excuses. The manager wasn't around so I ended up talking to the guy who did the work, right away he sees me and says "610 step right?" because he knows how much emphasis I put on it every time I have come in there. So I tell him how far off it is and he looks at it and immediately starts denying it could be off by that much. guesses it to be 605 and takes it into a back room obviously to check it. He then comes out without saying what it was and heads for the flywheel grinder telling me that it really shouldn't matter if they are off by .010 to .015 on a step flywheel etc etc and I obviously am telling him he is wrong and why. He then starts telling me there is no way they can accurately cut the step height on their equipment because it is old etc and not very accurate. I at this point am getting really mad and he keeps making excuses. I tell him that the first three I got from him were right on and how did he manage it then etc. Also I told him if he had questions about being able to do it to the spec I asked for, he should have told me then so I could take it somewhere else. He said we should take them somewhere else because his equipment wasn't accurate. Nice of him to wait till after he screws up our stuff to tell me that. Then to really infuriate me further, he checks it with a caliper and tells me to grab the flywheel and starts heading up front. He has just been cutting on this flywheel for a few minutes and has done enough of them to obviously know they are way to hot to touch after cutting but doesn't warn me or otherwise. So in my angry haste I grab the thing and start walking up front, meanwhile I probably have no more fingerprints and my fingers are on fire. I tell him he should have warned me about the heat and he chuckles and then sais oh yea and offers me a glove. I asked the guy at the front counter if he thought he would want to touch it and of course he says no way, too hot. (I was nice enought to warn him) I have never ground a flywheel so I really didn't know to expect that much heat. At any rate it was still too hot for Kyle to touch a half hour later when I got back to the shop. On another note, I havn't talked to the manager yet, I expect something out of this, we will see how he handles it. The other fun thing is that we have a 1G here that got a flywheel cut from them recently and it is also having engagment issues. Bet I know whats wrong there now, we were thinking bent clutch fork since everyone of the first 3 or 4 flywheels they cut were perfect at 610. So if you go there, you might want to consider their equipment etc as their machine shop guy put it, they can't be sure even how much he was taking off. That ispires confidence.

**JET** · 04-05-2005

Yeah, I have been back in their shop area. I was not impressed. They are great for getting some hard to find parts or race gas, but I would never let them do any machining work. They mostly work on SBC's, so they aren't used to having to be accurate.

1slowdsm · 04-05-2005

Wait a second...WTF. I just had my flywheel resurfaced there a few days ago. I was a day away from putting everything together. Is there a way that you guys can check the step on my flywheel to see if it's correct? If so, can I take my flywheel there and have it checked? I dont feel like going all the way back there and have to deal with what you had to deal with...Why can't people just do their jobs right...argh!

Onefast99gsx · 04-05-2005

You have access to a digital calipers? Just rest the calipers on the step and measure from the step down to the flywheel surface.

1slowdsm · 04-05-2005

If you're asking me. I have no idea what digital calipers are and probably wouldnt have access to it. I'll have to ask my shop teacher at school and see if he's got something like that. I saw a digital ruler looking like thing one time, but didnt know what it really was...

A//// Guy · 04-05-2005

Nice to know. That would really piss me off as well. Better get some money back for that type of work.

**JET** · 04-05-2005

1slowdsm, if you are near Fridley I have a depth guage. That is the best way to check the step. The caliper method will work, but isn't quite as accurate. Probably good enough for this purpose though.

Onefast99gsx · 04-05-2005

Yes, JETs right the caliper will work but won't be extremely accurate because of the difficultly to make sure its square on the ledge. The depth gauge is more like an upside down T shape. You screw the dial down until it meets with the surface and take the reading then.

1slowdsm · 04-05-2005

Oh, thats what it is. I think my teacher has one of those, but I'm sure he lost it somewhere. You know how kids are around tools that isn't their's, they never put it back where it belongs. I dont know where Fridley is, but it sounds quite a ways from Saint Paul.

Onefast99gsx · 04-05-2005

Fridley is off of 694, Be almost straight North of downtown Mpls. I believe University Ave. goes straight thru it.

**JET** · 04-05-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slowdsm

Oh, thats what it is. I think my teacher has one of those, but I'm sure he lost it somewhere. You know how kids are around tools that isn't their's, they never put it back where it belongs. I dont know where Fridley is, but it sounds quite a ways from Saint Paul.

I am just nw of st. paul, I am 3 miles from Roseville/35w. I may actually be heading down there soon, pm me and I might be able to stop by.

JET

Raptor · 04-05-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by JET

1slowdsm, if you are near Fridley I have a depth guage. That is the best way to check the step. The caliper method will work, but isn't quite as accurate. Probably good enough for this purpose though.

I would say it was a much better way to check it, I would say the best possible scenario would be a granite surface plate and height gauge

On that note, the best place to take a flywheel is definately Red Rooster on Lyndale in Bloomington. I just went up there to have this one redone and told them what all Kath had said, they were highly amused. At any rate, they checked it with a depth mic and as expected it was off by a couple thousanths still. They told me they can hold it to .0005" so they obviously don't have the same issues. I have never had a problem with a flywheel from them, we just tried Kath since they were closer.

I talked to the machine shop manager at Kath, he seemed very reasonable to deal with, he said he would call me back with details of their efforts to make this right, I will let you know how it comes out. But definately from now on, Dave or Rick at Red Rooster do know what they are doing and still charge $35 and have it done in an hour or so usually.

**1ViciousGSX** · 04-05-2005

Can you say "Pain & suffering"? I know a lawyer can. How are the fingers feeling, not quite right since the burn on the flywheel I'm sure. You've lost the magic touch now. I'm sure a lawyer would completely understand your new situation and how it relates to being able to do the job now.

Raptor · 04-05-2005

Hey, Kath finally got back to me on what they were willng to do. Boy I am thrilled, they are offereing to do 10 flywheels for free, oh sure, thats going to help you bet. I turned them down because I don't trust them that much if that tells you anything. That and honestly it only takes one of them to be wrong and get missed and installed to burn up all their $350 worth of credit and after seeing their equipment, I won't take that risk. I would rather spend the money and know for sure. I am still double and triple checking everyone of them from now on as well as looking for a surface plate to check them as well as other things as accurately as possible.

Jakey · 04-05-2005

So what did the manager say after you turned them down?

carltalon · 04-05-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1ViciousGSX

Can you say "Pain & suffering"? I know a lawyer can. How are the fingers feeling, not quite right since the burn on the flywheel I'm sure. You've lost the magic touch now. I'm sure a lawyer would completely understand your new situation and how it relates to being able to do the job now.

Mike has no case since he posted that he burnt his fingers picking up his brake pads last week. I think I see a pattern here.

Pimpin Dsmstyle · 04-05-2005

sorry you had to deal with that bs mike. Its a great thing that you are detailed orriented or you may have a lot more issues on your hands ( haha yes your hands) and not know what to do. Thanks for the info too, Ill be needing 2 flywheels done and will listen to you as usual

Raptor · 04-05-2005

Well, honestly, if the other car turns out to be the same issue, a lawyer will definately be contacted. They didn't have anything other than "really?" to say after I explained that I wouldn't use the same service I was unhappy with even if they donated it. I told him his equipment was old and crappy and his measuring talents were questionable. It was a short conversation after that hahaha.

BTW, the fact that my abused fingers can even feel heat after the welded stainless etc I am always picking up (as well as that damn Mighty Max Brake incident) is pretty amazing anyway. Tells you how hot that flywheel was, and that indicates a problem with their methods as well, it should not have been that hot if done right. The other guys confirmed this.

stikx · 04-05-2005

i hope you sue them for the damage property and yourself and for emotional distress get them on any accounts you can

TalonFiero · 04-05-2005

Mike, the guys over at rooster are good people. I know Dave pretty well, he always gets my flywheels. The first time I walked in there with my talon flywheel he said ".610" step, right?" Next time you stop in at rooster's shop tell Dave you built my motor.

Jim