Small turbos make me smile

[scheides]

I just had to re-post this here. This guy is typically what people love to rag on as a buschur nutswinger, but there is a ton of truth in what he says:

http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-dyn...wild-mild.html


This post is a testament to keeping your car FUN to drive! So many people are in a big rush to run out and buy the biggest baddest turbokit in the business, make big power, and then brag about it....few ever finish those setups because of the pricetags associated with such glory...instead keeping the car simple and fun is worth SO many more smiles and giggles.

In an ideal world maybe we all have two evos, one with a billet67 turbo for drag and big power, and another like this for daily fun and autoX ownage, but in the real world most of us only have enough for one car and if you have to make a choice, I always say keep it simple!

There are a TON of pieces of this post that echo a perfect setup that I planned on owning several years ago, a post made by david buschur himself:

http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-eng...ion-parts.html

I ended up putting a BBK on my evo8 but it just goes to show that the old fp green, BBK, or new fp hta green are fantastic fantastic turbos to run on your evo, especially because they typically don't push the limit on the stock bottom-end.

[dragonov_elite]

I like it. The whole keeping the car fun to drive is why I don't think ill ever go bigger than a 35r.

[TkrPerformance]

That is great for people that use there car for a d.d. To keep the car fun to drive.

[Tachyon]

Preach, brother!

In the modern day of internet nut-swingers, where people care more about numbers than balance, that was a refreshing read.

I've had a lot of different turbo and engine setups over the last 10 years, and I still think my favorite for a street car was 9:1 comp, E85, and 25 psi on a 14b. You would just think the word go and the nearly vertical wall of torque would leap the car 100' forward. Obviously low HP, but higher thrust ratios than most larger framed turbos -and in any gear.

[95talonracer]

Exactly what I have told people many times. And if you do go bigger then to it right and don't skip out anywhere because it leads to hasle in the end.

[Matt D.]

Small turbos reign supreme. I won't lie, my car could use some more top end grunt, but when someone drives my car in an autocross and tells me that it scared them then I must have done something right.

[awd-drifter]

I've always like my car well balanced. I always told my brother about how fun instant boost can be rather than boost coming in at the higher revs...bigger turbos (T3/T4 yo!) vs smaller turbos (14b's to the e316g). I'm sure it depends on your goals but definitely lovin' the stock frame turbos for the Evo's and the E316G is definitely one hell of a turbo. I don't ever think I will go "bigger" then an FP Black. lol.

[Tachyon]

Originally Posted by Matt D.

Small turbos reign supreme. I won't lie, my car could use some more top end grunt, but when someone drives my car in an autocross and tells me that it scared them then I must have done something right.

lol, nice! I always think back to MiNES skyline, and the stupid fast engine response from any RPM. just the sex.

I think if I were to ever run a large turbo again, it would be a 100mm turbo on a gutted/caged EG6 with the soul intent of fucking up 1 liter bikes and certain turbo Gallardos from 100-200MPH.

[mlomker]

I've never driven a T3/T4 car but based on the graphs it isn't for me. I'm not sure that any stock-frame turbo really crosses the usability line.

[Speedfreak]

It's all relative, and as time goes on, what is considered "small" keeps getting bigger. Ten years ago when I was on my big 16g setup, my 339whp was huge. A couple years later, Shanes 600+whp(Elite dyno) was huge, now 1000+whp is huge.

With that, my dsm with a fully supported 2.4l and a gt3561 feels like a conservative/reliable setup(500ish whp on Shanes?). I don't think I could drive a car that is supposed to keep me happy power wise that was any lower than 400whp on Shanes dyno. But at the same time, when I build a car, I build it for reliability(as much as possible of course).

[1QUICK4]

I thought over boosting small frame turbos was the DSMers creed

[Tachyon]

Originally Posted by Speedfreak

I don't think I could drive a car that is supposed to keep me happy power wise that was any lower than 400whp on Shanes dyno.

You should really drive a road that has "turns" on it

[scheides]

Originally Posted by Speedfreak

I don't think I could drive a car that is supposed to keep me happy power wise that was any lower than 400whp on Shanes dyno. But at the same time, when I build a car, I build it for reliability(as much as possible of course).

Yip, same for a lot of people, which is why I really like these sized turbos. Even on the most basic setup they'll make 400whp at DB all day long.

http://www.evomn.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6804

[Speedfreak]

Originally Posted by Tachyon

You should really drive a road that has "turns" on it

I prefer "turns", and I still like the aforementioned power levels.

[Matt D.]

When you consider a car as a machine with the ability to go, stop and turn it becomes quite apparent that 300-400whp is plenty for the vast majority of people. It's not until you are at the limit of adhesion going through a corner at 60mph+, you hit the apex and power out of the turn that you really understand how much power you really have control of. Any more than that and an inexperienced driver would wind up going the wrong way off the pavement, or worse. Add in the fact that most people do not upgrade their brakes and suspension when they reach these power levels and the chance for disaster increases.

When I discovered that my measly 300whp/wtq car could spin the wheels on wet pavement in 2nd gear I truly understood how much of a car I was in control of. The unfortunate part of all this is people fail to understand how much fun a car of this power level is, and there's so much more to it than going fast in a straight line. Small turbos truly shine when you're turning the wheel.

[19TsiAwd90]

has a e316g ever hit 400 at db? this was my original goal but i relized it probably wasnt going to happen so i lowered it to 340

[turbotalon1g]

Originally Posted by 1QUICK4

I thought over boosting small frame turbos was the DSMers creed

It's how I roll. True DSMer yo.

Can everyone stop using T3/T4 as a size reference, all you are doing is naming the exhaust inlet flange and T3 is different from T4, let the honda idiots keep talking like that and awd-drifter apparently.

This thread is good for 2 reasons, I wanted to talk to scheides about his "small turbo" love, the turbo's he seems to like are these 50lb/min (3052, 3076, etc) things that a 16G just wont do, maybe the new 68hta. But i have to agree that size is perfect I know I loved my bolt-on holset which is comparable to those.

2nd, is my friend is asking my what I want to do with my car and I can honestly not describe what I want, but I want the response and some top end. It's even harder with an auto and an Auto DSM at that we all know 1Gs can't turn.

I think a 2.3 with a green would be mint for a tire shredding, cone-dodging DD, it would still go in a straight line fast enough to be most of the things you will run into.

That dudes powerband is exactly what I want, straight line HP to redline (8k)

Thanks for posting.

[Goat Blower]

It's the new trend, a lot of the former 500+whp club like myself have already done that and want to go back to something more drivable. i suppose it also ties to tons of people getting bored with import drag racing and looking for other venues to have fun.

[Halon]

To each their own. But I agree, for me it's all about useable power band. I loved the power my Talon made, but hated that I had to wait for 5000+ RPM's to get there. Hence my reason for choosing something with a little more displacement. People joke that my turbo choice is tiny for my car, but that's fine. My goal is to have a car that is fast and enjoyable to drive.

To each their own!

[awd-drifter]

Originally Posted by turbotalon1g

It's how I roll. True DSMer yo.

Can everyone stop using T3/T4 as a size reference, all you are doing is naming the exhaust inlet flange and T3 is different from T4, let the honda idiots keep talking like that and awd-drifter apparently.

Hahahah! I was jokin' with the T3/T4 because the Honda guys I chill around with still talk about that turbo like it is the greatest most powerful turbo out there when a ebay e316g would probably give them a better powerband.

I don't mind going with the bigger turbos but I know there's more and more you need to do to get that thing to reach it's potential. I'd like to be in the passenger seat of a pretty big turbo Evo though.