Got An Idea, What Do You Guys Think?

LightningGSX · 12-07-2003

I got an idea for a product and am wondering what you guys think before I blow a bunch of money on a patent.A timer that delays the ignition for a couple of seconds to allow the starter to crank and pump fresh oil to turbo,bearings,etc. before the engine fires.Maybe add a turbo timer and make it a plug in installation and some low battery protection.Good? bad? already been done?

**Kracka** · 12-08-2003

That is a very good idea, I was thinking of that last year and wondered why nobody had done that yet.

niterydr · 12-08-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by LightningGSX@Dec 7 2003, 11:54 PM
I got an idea for a product and am wondering what you guys think before I blow a bunch of money on a patent.A timer that delays the ignition for a couple of seconds to allow the starter to crank and pump fresh oil to turbo,bearings,etc. before the engine fires.Maybe add a turbo timer and make it a plug in installation and some low battery protection.Good? bad? already been done?

It is an awesome product idea, we would carry it, and it should sell within the 3s market nicely

.
What would you use for delay/etc...?
never heard of it being done?
would this put extra wear on the starter? (excessive cranking)
great idea

**Kracka** · 12-08-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by niterydr@Dec 8 2003, 01:37 AM
What would you use for delay/etc...?

would this put extra wear on the starter? (excessive cranking)

1) 3 seconds should do it

2) of course, but whats worse...and oil starved cold started engine or going to the junkyard and dropping $10 for a new starter?

**Kracka** · 12-08-2003

A lot of big diesel equipment actually use an electric pump to prime the oil system before starting.

niterydr · 12-08-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by TalonTSiDude+Dec 8 2003, 12:39 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (TalonTSiDude @ Dec 8 2003, 12:39 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-niterydr@Dec 8 2003, 01:37 AM
What would you use for delay/etc...?

would this put extra wear on the starter? (excessive cranking)

1) 3 seconds should do it

2) of course, but whats worse...and oil starved cold started engine or going to the junkyard and dropping $10 for a new starter? [/b][/quote]
I know, just presenting questions he is going to be asked.
Actually i was looking into that 'electric oil pump' idea for my own use, but if someone makes something plug and play, i'll buy it cause im lazy/busy

.

CVD · 12-08-2003

Not a bad idea, but im thinking that the engine is cranking over without oil pressure anyway at first. Does it even matter whether or not combustion is taking place?

MustGoFaster · 12-08-2003

Good idea, the McLaren F1 doesn't start till 4 complete revolutions or something like that. So like 2 seconds would be good in my opinon. But I'm a cheap person and would probably figure it out for my self rather than buy one.

niterydr · 12-08-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by CVD@Dec 8 2003, 12:54 AM
Not a bad idea, but im thinking that the engine is cranking over without oil pressure anyway at first. Does it even matter whether or not combustion is taking place?

that is true.
I think im back to the electric oil pump/prime idea that was being tossed around 3si.

LightningGSX · 12-08-2003

I would think you would still build oil pressure,I already made a prototype, I'll have to test that tommorrow.Your starter only cranks the engine at a few hundred RPM as apposed to 800+ when it is running.

LightningGSX · 12-08-2003

Anybody know of a where I can get the plug in turbo timer harnesses quick locally?

niterydr · 12-08-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by LightningGSX@Dec 8 2003, 01:21 AM
I would think you would still build oil pressure,I already made a prototype, I'll have to test that tommorrow.Your starter only cranks the engine at a few hundred RPM as apposed to 800+ when it is running.

i love it, first you make a prototype then you ask.
maybe do some testing of it after it works, check with a real oil pressure gauge with and without use of 'primer' and maybe give an elapsed time. To bad you couldn't retap the gauge somewhere far away (head) from the oil pump, run a series to prove it helps..
Cvd's point is the engine still spins regardless.

**Kracka** · 12-08-2003

Elite should have some harnesses in stock, if they don't I know Archer in Duluth does and if you order by 4pm you should see it the next business day.

LightningGSX · 12-08-2003

I made the prototype after I posted the question.I was thinking of testing right at the turbo?or maybe on the head?

**Goat Blower** · 12-08-2003

It'd be nice, but the bearings already have a oil film on them from the last time the car ran. If your oil isn't old and lost it's viscosity, it should cling to internal parts pretty nicely. That would explain why our motors consistently can go 200K miles without being rebuilt. Bearing materials, build quality and better oils have improved tremendously since the 60's, when 100K miles was considered a good time to rebuild if it made it that far.

I don't know how long it takes from the point the oil pump spins til the number four bearings see ~80 psi of oil pressure. Probably less than a second.

Raptor · 12-08-2003

This is a concept that has been around for years and is done in a different way by many domestic cars already, as well as for some other reasons. Alot of the V8 cars running a ton of ignition advance run 2 switches, one for the starter and one for the ignition. They push a button to run the starter to get the engine rpms as high as the starter will take it, then flip a toggle for the ignition system so the engine will start easier. Priming the oil pump etc is just a side benefit for them. They had to do that type of thing because there were no coputers controling timing advance, but that has obiously changed now.

I do think this is a good idea for our cars as long as the timing was easily adjustable. I would definately tie one into my wireing system. Alamo motorsports has the best deals on TT harnesses that I have seen, and the shipping is pretty quick.

520Talon · 12-08-2003

An accusump does what your talking about and also will keep oil pressure up durring high g corners and such where oil might slosh away from the pick up. Road racers use them all the time. Don't know about the 1/4 milers though.

Accusump

LightningGSX · 12-08-2003

Those accumulators have been around for over a decade I wonder why you don't see or hear much about them.

12-08-2003

fuel will still be getting pumped in, so it might be a little smokey when you start up

A//// Guy · 12-08-2003

Which will then gum up the engine..

CVD point about whether combustion and no combustion (crank while no igniton is on)makes a huge difference is what i think should be thought about. I dont know if its such a big deal how much longer will a turbo survive or an engine survive witht his mechanism applied.. maybe from new would be ok but high miles motor will not be worth it.