Attempt to make things right

[HiImBrian]

Thanks Kracka.

Halon I was a little sarcastic about what I said to neil. I was planning on getting everything done at once last summer. No Jake wasn't going to pay for anything, but I was financially ready to pay for my tune back then and things are a little rougher now that's all.

I was a little intoxicated when I posted that, but basically kracka said exactly what I was thinking.

example: I had a macbook a while back and it went to hell. Everything was breaking on it and the harddrive eventually crashed. I went back numerous time and was really frustrated with the whole thing. For a while I had nothing but bad stuff to say about my mac. They ended up replacing the whole laptop with a newer nicer one. Now I tell ppl about their great customer service whenever I get the chance.

[Halon]

And that makes sense, because it Mac's product that failed, so they replaced it. If you paid for a tune from him, and never received it, then yeah he owes you one. But you didn't. You ordered some injectors, which took them quite awhile to get them to you, but you actually did receive in them in the end. What does that have to do with them owing you $300+ for a tune? You're stretching it there.

BTW, I'm not backing this company up. I think it's already fucked and sure as hell won't be getting my money, nor can I see them getting much local business at all.

[HiImBrian]

^ok I'll try to make this a little more clear for ya. I was being somewhat sarcastic. I'd like to see SOMETHING done for those that got screwed, not necessarily money. Ok sorry you didn't catch on

[Kracka]

We stopped by the shop today while scouting the cruise route to check things out and chat it up but didn't seem like anyone was there (or just not answering the knocks, there were 2 cars outside).

[twack]

To bad you didnt stop by my place im 2 block away

[EclipseGST]

I hate fucking drama… That is the main reason I don’t post here anymore. I admit I made a pretty shitty name for myself and MY business which I take blame for, no questions asked. After talking with Kracka I honestly feel that this cant get much worse that it already is, even if it does so be it. No way to find out without posting.

This “attempt to make things right” is not entirely true. Making lies to cover lies is not how I want this to turn out. I am serious about trying to fix things. I really wanted this loan to go through for that reason alone. I was ready to put everything I had on the line just to fix this shit that should have been done from the beginning even if it means “giving up” my business ownership for a few years. Although still being an equal partner just not on paper.

I’m not here to hide anything. Scheides, Kracka, Mark, and Kevin, I wish I would have been at the shop when you were there. It would have actually been nice to meet you and talk in person instead of talking over a forum. I didn’t make it there until 2:30. Sorry guys. Brian has my number, should have gotten that from him with the shop info.

I'm not here to start any more problems because I can clearly see that Jake has started plenty. I also see that he has fessed up to most of them and apologized as well. I personally, just found out about all this sh!t goin down and I have taken ownership of Vogel Performance since the 1st of January. Am I bit pissed off.....uh, yeah. Am I thinking about pulling the plug all together on the whole project.....fuckin right. I too was lied to and kept in the dark.

Actually, you have not taken ownership of anything yet… I didn’t feel the need to bring my past into this because it is my past. This was me starting over. It was basically helping you out and you helping me like we talked about.

Basically, the money that was collected was used to keep the rent paid and what-not until the SBA loan came through. I had NO idea where the money came from that was paying the rent. I was told that it was obtained legitimately.

Actually it wasn’t used for shop rent until the loan came through. I paid that out of my pocket from working and part from selling my car. I wouldn’t have sold my car if I didn’t need some extra money.

Jake needed me for my credit, obviously, to help get the loan. But, because the loan is 100% in my name, I also have a contract done up by a lawyer to protect myself. I have a lot invested in this "project" and won't get left with my dick out in the wind, I assure you. I will also see what I can do to make previous engagements "right" once again. I understand that there is money owed, or engines owed and I will do what I can to see those promises fulfilled. I won't lie, the SBA loan has not come through yet, so we are idle at this time. Anyone who has dealt with the government knows it can take forever to get things done.

I didn’t “need” you for your credit. That was just a bonus. When we first started talking about this whole thing did I ask you, “Hey, what’s your credit like”? Nope! We didn’t figure out that your credit would be the only thing used until after we handed everything into the bank. Don’t make it sound like I wanted to go into business with you just for your credit. That’s not what I was doing it for.

I hope that clears things up a bit. After reading all the threads on different DSM sites, I'm not sure how much business I'll actually have, but it's something I've wanted to do for a long time. I used to wrench for a shop after 2 years of tech school and they didn't pay squat. So I got into truckin to make some good money. I told myself that I would never wrench again unless it was for myself. Now I have the opportunity and it's blemished by this. Consider me equally annoyed. If Jake were an equal partner in this, I would have already backed out. But currently, I am the owner of Vogel Performance. I am going to attempt to ride this out and hope that I can help heal the proverbial scarring that Jake has left with the name.

Like I said before, you haven’t taken ownership of anything yet. Not until the loan goes through and we sign the contract. Since when am I not an equal partner? Because of the loan, you said it would only be on paper as you would be the owner until I am put on the loan. And I was suppose to get everything off the ground for 4-6 months until we got a decent customer base, money started coming in and you could get out of he truck, then what, get rid of me and you’ll be sitting where you want?

Neil, welcome to the forum. I don't think people will have a problem with you at all, or even the name of the business name, if you can't change it. If you have Jake working there though, that is going to be an issue. You know all about Jake now, and now we know why he FINALLY tried to clear things up and admitted to what he did. Notice that he didn't admit to any of it until very recently?

The only reason I posted when I did is because people made such a HUGE deal about where I was or what I was doing when THEY didn’t have anything to do with the situation. Did you notice the people that I have been dealing with weren’t posting. I posted because I’m not hiding like everyone thinks I am. I talk to a few people on this board just about every other day or so, have done business with a few of the members here as well, but people that have nothing to do with me or my business still consider it big news if they see me post on another board. GET A LIFE!

I say change the name of the shop if at all possible, ditch Jake all together and make a go of it on your own or find another partner. I wish you luck, it isn't an easy thing to jump into.

The name WILL NOT be changed. Don’t worry about ditching me… Everyone’s advice has been taken. Consider it done. I'm out! :)

I would have posted sooner but was was a victim of the ban stick. So let me get this straight, you were with jake this whole time and had no idea he was screwing all these people out of their money? Hell, all you had to do was google search Jake Vogel and you could find a ton of people that he screwed over.

You seem like a pretty nice guy, but then so did Jake right before he took everyones money. I can promise you will see absolutely no business from me nor will you see any good comments about Vogel Performance coming from my direction until Jake is completely out of the picture. Hell the guy just IMed me a few weeks ago just to let me know I left my lug nut key in his garage and he threw it away. Something tells me Jake has not changed one bit and as long as you are working with him your business has some major problems.

If you didn't know Jake was stealing money before whos to say you wont realize he's doing it again?

Wow, you are full of shit too… I never said I threw it away. I said if you want me to I can cause I don’t need it and you said that’s cool, you could just get a new one from the local parts store instead of running all the way down here. I haven’t thrown it away yet either. I’m not that big of an asshole. I told you I would keep it if you wanted it back.

Neil was not “with” me this whole time. We didn’t submit the first part of the papers for the loan until the middle of December. Which had to be changed and the final copies were submitted last week.

Technically I didn’t “steal” money. It was given to me for parts and they have not been delivered yet. Cant steal something that is given to you. I am fully prepared to follow through with any deals that were made and supply parts or services that were already paid for. I’m not just up and ditching town like someone else we all know.

Im one of those people that base my opinion on first impression. One local shop rubbed me the wrong way and never went back, another was great from the minute I bought something from them and I buy 90% of my parts from them because of that. So just make good impression on your new customers and Im sure that you will end up alright. But like you said the cards are against you.

If you are basing your opinion off your first impression, then would it be good? Considering I sold you an O2 housing made for a 38mm external w/g a few years ago and you seemed to be happy with the deal. I even wanted to buy it back from you. Although in the other thread you stated I sold you a Magnus SMIM and I screwed you. I’m sorry but you must be mistaking me for someone else because I have never owned one or sold one.

[EclipseGST]

At this point, I think Jake will still be a part of the endeavor. I don't know the Jake that you all know. And yes, he did hide this from me, but I can sort of understand why in a messed up kinda way.

However, the more I read through the posts in this thread and the other one, I am feeling that I may change the name of the shop. It'll be kind of a bitch because everything is set up already, but it may be worth the hassle.

I don’t think I’m ready for the “endeavor” anymore. I didn’t “hide” this from you. I didn’t feel the need to bring up my past. And when it was brought up, I told you about it, showed you the threads on the other boards, and so forth. But the funny thing, you never mentioned this thread to me or anything about YOU being the ONLY owner or changing the name of the business. Which I stated before WILL NOT be changed. I am the owner of Vogel Performance and I plan on keeping it that way. Whether there is a partner or not.

I’m not going to run away from my past by changing the name of the shop or anything else.

I havent taken a fixed opinion on either side of this, yes jake fucked up but I know many people who have fucked up before and finally straightened things out. With that said and what I know if the situation I would say go through the hassle and change the name... it may take more time to get things rolling but I feel it would benefit you better for your initial launch and give you a step up for a fighting chance

Thank you for your input. You are one of the few who “haven’t taken a fixed opinion on either side” and I appreciate that. I wish others would take to this as I haven’t done business with 90% of the people saying I will never have a chance because I fucked up. People fuck up, not saying its ok, I wish I hadn’t. Doesn’t help much when I am working on fixing things and everyone that has nothing to do with the situation continues to talk all this shit when they have no clue what is going on. Doesn’t make me really want to try any harder but yet I am.

Honestly, if others decide to go down on your dyno day I will be making the trip my self and letting every customer know about the situation.

I believe in forgiving people, but I honestly don't think Jake has changed at all which is truely sad, to others and my self he used to seem like a really good guy.

Just wait until you meet the real Jake, everybody else thought they knew the real Jake and look what came out of it.

So that being said who is gonna be showing up at their dyno day?

You don’t know me (at least I do not know you), so why talk? You are bashing someone you know only what you read about on the internet or what others have told you. You have nothing to do with this situation, you’re cool.

This is the “real” me. Last year when this all went down, that wasn’t the “real” me. Shit happens.

There will not be a dyno day. Sorry to burst your bubble.

well Neil, I see it this way. If Jake is still part of the shop then changing the name is just a way to trick people into thinking they aren't doing business with Jake when they really are (which a lot of people including myself would not like to do). If Jake is going to be part of your business then I think the name should stay what it is so people know who they are working with.

Correct, that’s why the name will remain the same. Then IF I do get business, it will be because people can see I’ve changed or have trusted me all along for those customers that I had before this and still have from the site and community.

I'm not just angry because it took jake 5 months to send me a set of injectors. I'm more angry that after a year or so of knowing jake and becoming actually good friends with him I was just left in the dirt all of a sudden. Hell I used to call him any time of the day with simple little questions like what order to plug in my spark plug wires and he'd know right away (or on his second guess lol). It just sucks when your friendship turns out to be worth a couple hundo.

Its not like that at all. You know what happened, whether you choose to believe it or not is your decision. Don’t you remember the little chat we had in October about how you’d rather have money, so I sent the injectors back and was going to refund your money, then turned around and said you’d rather have your injectors, so I ordered them again, then you did the same shit AGAIN. Told me to send them back, so I did. Then said you wanted them so I ordered them again. Then I ended up shipping them to you like you asked by the end of December. Then once you got the injectors all this shit talking started. Texting shit to my girlfriend and such, seriously grow up. She had nothing to do with this, leave her out of it and come deal with me if you got issues. No, texting her did not get me to send the injectors. All that did was entertain her and how you tried so hard.

Hey neil, looks like we should probably have a little chit chat,... I'll be sending you an email shortly.

If you are going to continue to work with jake, I'd suggest you work on figuring out a way to tell if hes lying or not. Maybe he winks twice after every lie, maybe its just every time he opens his mouth, I'm 2000+ miles away, so its hard for me to figure that kind of stuff out.

Such a nice email. I’ve been keeping in contact with you, giving you updates and such. I’m sorry I’m not online EVERY night at 4am CST to chat with you. I do live a normal life and have a job. You say you call me and I never call you back, but you NEVER leave a message cause “you don’t like leaving messages” so when I don’t have service or my phone is off, how am I suppose to know you called?

You asked me to send you your stock pistons/rods back and that would make you trust me a little and lift the stress a little. Saying you would even pay for shipping once you received them. I did as you asked. In return, you didn’t follow through with paying shipping, not like I really expected you to though. But then you can turn around and email Neil about how you are going to put me behind bars and sue me for everything that I’ve done including everything that has happened between other people. What the fuck man. Should I just say fuck it and wait for that day instead of wasting money and time trying to fix this? I don’t get it but am curious to know.

You're right, actions speak louder than words. Wanna pay the 300+ for my tune that I would have had by now if jake would have sent my stuff on time? Thad be a pretty "loud" action don't ya think?

You haven’t paid for it yet, so you should still have the money. Nice try pretty boy.
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With all that being said, the shop will remain Vogel Performance. I will continue to work there as I do with what customers I have now and those I get throughout the future. If people choose not to due business with me due to my past that is completely fine with me. I deserve it and will take the hit. There are a lot of different cars out there that need maintenance besides DSMs so I feel as if I can still go on and I will continue to try to better the business.

Like I said before, I do not post here anymore because of the drama. I took the advice of someone and decided to post to continue to tell the truth. I honestly just wanted to let it go, let you believe what you want and not come back to MitsuStyle as it seems nothing but drama occurs when I post here. I’m not hiding, or whatever everyone is thinking I am doing. If I have no business with you, I do not feel the need to talk to you or post letting you know what my day to day activities are. If you really want to know, just ask.

If anyone wants to stop by the shop like those of you who already have, go right ahead. Let me know your coming and I’ll be more than willing to show you around. I seriously don’t understand why people make other peoples business their own. Do you not have a life? Do you have nothing better to do then follow me around, find out stuff about me and post it on the internet? Then bash me like you know every piece of detail and you had part in the deal. You are doing a lot of work for nothing when you can just ask me.

I hate to bring this up because I don’t want to reference this business but it was already brought up in this thread. Look at Slowboy Racing. How many people have they fucked over. Have they tried to fix it? Sure maybe a couple people. Many people do not like them and will never give them business, myself included. But saying I do not have a chance because of a fuck up I had with a couple people is like saying they don’t have a chance when they have fucked over many of the people on here, let alone across the nation. Yet in my eyes (Numbers related only) they are the most successful DSM performance related business in the country. How is that?

I’m not trying to be like SBR nor do I condone their business actions. I’m not trying to become a millionaire by working on cars either. I’m just doing something that I enjoy doing while I still can, being working on cars for a living.

Neil, you’ve been a great friend, but I think a business relationship probably will not work out. I do not want to drag you into my problems as it clearly seems you and everyone else thinks I am trying to do. I also don’t want to be the reason for you to quit your job, then have the business fail and it ruin your life. If this is ruins our friendship, I’m sorry for that as it was not my intensions. Although I’d rather lose a friend over ruining your life/family you’ve worked so hard for.

To everyone else, I’m sorry. This has gotten WAY out of hand.

[EclipseGST]

On that note I will end it. This is getting a bit long and I apologize for that. If you have a question, feel free to ask. You can PM me, email me, do whatever you need to in order to satisfy your need. Whatever makes you happy I guess.

Thanks for your time.

Jake



Off topic: Wow hit the post limit twice! Sorry for the novel!

[HiImBrian]

Wow, you are full of shit too… I never said I threw it away. I said if you want me to I can cause I don’t need it and you said that’s cool, you could just get a new one from the local parts store instead of running all the way down here. I haven’t thrown it away yet either. I’m not that big of an asshole. I told you I would keep it if you wanted it back.

Unfortunately, I didn't save your texts that night but I am pretty sure you said you threw them away with other garbage. All I really remember you saying was that I will probably never graduate and how you will always make more money than me because you don't work for anybody. But lets put that aside and go out on a limb and say that in between all the harassing texts that were being sent both ways you did mention you would send me the lock key, after the whole deal with the injectors do you really think I would wanna deal with you sending me anything again? haha forget it. If you wanna go ahead and send it to me now go ahead. I will gladly post up when I get it for others to see you're really "trying." Don't ask me to pay for shipping though because I'm not sending you any more money. I think you can afford the $5 and I'll take it as a legit apology.


Its not like that at all. You know what happened, whether you choose to believe it or not is your decision. Don’t you remember the little chat we had in October about how you’d rather have money, so I sent the injectors back and was going to refund your money, then turned around and said you’d rather have your injectors, so I ordered them again, then you did the same shit AGAIN. Told me to send them back, so I did. Then said you wanted them so I ordered them again. Then I ended up shipping them to you like you asked by the end of December. Then once you got the injectors all this shit talking started. Texting shit to my girlfriend and such, seriously grow up. She had nothing to do with this, leave her out of it and come deal with me if you got issues. No, texting her did not get me to send the injectors. All that did was entertain her and how you tried so hard.

I did ask you to just refund the money but only once. I initially ordered the injectors and then after a few months I started getting frustrated. You said you didn't have time to get to the post office. Member our talk about how you don't even have time to shit everyday? So this was why I thought I'd have a better chance of getting anything if I chose the money. I then second guessed myself after a while and decided that I might as well stick with getting the injectors thinking that well my chances of getting either of the two things is about the same. So I will admit I caused some trouble for you. But you once told me how gullible I am believing everything you say, so please Jake, humor me and tell me why I should believe everything you said then or now.

And yea I apologize that I had to go as far as texting Amy. I never wanted to because I actually think Amy is a nice girl. I simply asked her to talk to you for me since you wouldn't call me back. I actually did leave you messages which never got returned. I knew texting Amy would get you pissed so I used that to my advantage. And just a little fyi Jake, since then Amy and myself have both apologized to each other and made up. I had a buddy tell her I felt bad about bringing her into this mess and she came back a few weeks later and texted me!

In conclusion, I think that you and Neil need to work something out because it looks like so far you both have done things and not told the other about it. This does not make for a very stable business relationship. I will say that I am impressed you took the time to post what you have. That was a somewhat mature thing to do.

[nchittendon]

In conclusion, I think that you and Neil need to work something out


Yeah, I think Jake and I need to have a long talk. Unfortunately, he hasn't answered his phone, or returned all of my messages since Friday.

Who knows, maybe his phone got shut off?

Jake, I know you're reading this, gimmie a call, huh?