Nopi Nationals Sept 24-25 Moroso - Page 3

Outlaw1 · 10-01-2005

Sounds like you have an injector problem or possibly an injector harness problem. Injector harnesses have constant voltage and are switched on the ground side. It doesn't take much of a chafe on the wire somewhere to get it to ground and stick wide open. Usually a problem like that is intermittent. When the car is idling can you feel/hear the #2 injector pulsing strong or does it thump like a dead injector? If you don't get that cylinder firing soon you might wash the rings out in that cylinder. Swap #2 injector with another cylinder and go from there. You have compression, your coil pack isn't bad, the amount of fuel is just overwhelming for the plug to burn. Hope you get it sorted out.

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

went to Moroso last night: won't go back on a friday again felt like Rock Falls import day. other then track prep was good. I was there for 4hrs and only go 3 runs in.

1st run - 13.2@106mph on a 2.2- 60' (stutterbox launched at 6250 and almost stalled cause the car gripped to well) I raced against a GT2 Porsche that went 12.7@113mph He put 3 lenghts on me in 1st gear, a guy I was talking to got it on tape.

2nd Run - I went 12.99@108mph with a 1.98 (upped the launch to 7K) slipped the clutch in first and the clutch didn't hold so I had to shift into 2nd early again this was against the same GT2 but this time he went 12.1@114mph

http://www.scottbarton.net/Brian/Ecl...129_108mph.dat

after the 2nd run I was talking with a guy who owns a Firebird, and I was telling him about the issues I was having with my car, and that it seemed I got my high reving issue worked out, but I'm not sure about the spark issue. That's when I'd realized I'd left my spark plug socket in the car, so I pulled the #2 spark plug again to find it still completely black and full of fuel, I then pulled the #1 spark plug to find it a very nice grey color, I showed the guy the difference, and he couldn't believe I was running 12.9@108mph on what looks like either intermintent fire or only 3 cylinders.

I then switched the #2 wire with the #3 wire as shane wanted as I forgot.

3rd Run - I went 13.1@110mph with a 2.0 - 60' (I upped the boost a little)
http://www.scottbarton.net/Brian/Ecl...131_110mph.dat

After that the rain really started coming down so I called it quites. But not before weighing my car... 3100lbs with out me in it.

On the way home I had a lot of fun with the Mustang group:

2xfox body's were going at it on the highway on the way home, after the first one passed me I saw the 2nd one coming up from behind and when he got to about a lenght behind my rear bumper I canned it, and by the time he got to my door I was pulling away from him.

Now for the real fun part of the night - I came up on a Silver 03 cobra who was at the front of the mustang group, and when I cruised passed him slowly he sped up to match my speed, I shifted into 3rd gear at about 5000 rpms which is good for spool up.

When we went I got a little bit of a jump put about 1/2 car on him, then he caught up to my Front bumper before he had to shift, I then put 1 lenght on him, and then I had a car infront of me so I had to slow down.

He wanted another shot, he was practicing "Break Boosting" before he slowed down to line up against my car (ie: he was just sitting 2 legths in front of me doing this)

We lined up again this time I was I think around 4300rpms which isn't the best for immediate spoolup. but I got lucky he jumped the gun and then slowed up which allowed me to get higher into my RPM gear he matched me on the launch this time and we took off, He put about a nose infront of my car when he had to shift, then I put another 1.5 lengths on him by the time we hit trafic again.

The only reason I won these races were because I had a 9K rpms limit he was almost having to shift twice for every 1 of my gears.

Here is the log of both races:
http://www.scottbarton.net/Brian/Ecl...gs/03Cobra.dat

I still have yet to pull the spark plugs to see if switching the #2 and #3 coil changed anything.

But I fixed the I/C pipe so it didn't blow off and I got my 9K Rev limit back.

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

So far there is no change in the spark plugs, maybe I just don't have enough time on them

**JET** · 10-01-2005

It's not running good? Throw more boost at it!! That is awesome

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

Well the car was starting out at 18psi and then climbing to 25 by red line like always, except at a much slower pass, I think when I did the boost leak test, I did something to slow it down. On the original boost setting I would have seen 56lbs/min but at the track I was only seeing 52-53lbs.min

Wasn't till I turned the boost back up to 22psi (climbing to 25 by redline) that I was seeing 54-55lbs/min again. Like normal.

The car honestly felt/feels like it's running great. if I didn't know about the #2 cylcinder I would honestly think there was nothing wrong with the car.

I just remembered that not only did I change the spark plug wires but I also swapped spark plugs, I swapped the #1 and #2 spark plugs before I left to go up to the track. And those were the ones I pulled and the #2 was pitch black like the pictures, and the #1 went from pitch black to a nice Grey.

Also I switched the wires so that #2 and #3 are reversed like shane said. But nothing changed (only about 19 miles on the car and about 5 pulls) So now what does that mean? could the CAS be bad? would the harness be bad? what are my next steps?

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

I've swapped the #1 with the #2 injector - no change.

I've swapped the #1 spark plug wire with the #2 wire - no change

I've put in new spark plugs - no change

I've swapped the #1 spark Plug with the #2 - no change

I've hooked up the #2 spark plug wire into the #3 spot - No change

I've adjusted Timing so that it's set at 5 degrees - NO change

I have an oil leak that's pulling oil on my Valve cover, I just yesterday changed the Valve cover Gasket, along with all 4 of the spark plug gaskets and I'm still getting Oil on the Valve cover. Could this oil leak be part of the problem? I no longer get any smoke out the back of my car like I did when I went to Moroso for NOPI, not even when I'm Stutterbox launching.

At cruising speed my EGT's are at 14-14.5 (70mph), when I go WOT, at 9K Rpms my EGT's are sitting right about 1600-1650.

I have yet to change anything as far as fuel / Timing since swapping to 6 bolt.

But I did notice today when trying to adjust my HP configuration now that I know my weight. (3100lb car, with 225lb driver, Tires are 220/40/18) that the CAS invert isn't activated my car battery as died twice since I first posted when my fuel pump wire disconnected (I'd left the dome light on and didn't catch it as I never work on my car at night) So the ECU reset itself each time, I need invert the CAS right?

Outlaw1 · 10-01-2005

I took it for granted the fouled plug in the picture was flat black (fuel fouled). Is it shiny black (oil fouled)? You should be able to smell the raw fuel on the plug if it's fuel fouled. Let's start at square one.

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

I'll warm up the car again and then pull the plug. that way I know it's gone through a cycle again.

x-pride · 10-01-2005

Do you have a tubelar exhaust manifold? If so how close is the manifold to your number two cylinder? I know that wrx's have issue with number two or three cylinder because of how the exhuast sits closer to that cylinder.

Outlaw1 · 10-01-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by x-pride

Do you have a tubelar exhaust manifold? If so how close is the manifold to your number two cylinder? I know that wrx's have issue with number two or three cylinder because of how the exhuast sits closer to that cylinder.

Looks like a T3 Turbonetics manifold with a Tial 38mm WG on #1.

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

I have a Turbonetics T3 Exhaust manifold with the Tial 38mm on the #1 runner. but I've never heard of any DSM's having this issue, Moe runs one on his car, John Lacroix I believe ran one on his car.

Anyrate Just got done warming it up and driving it around the apartment complex.

I swapped the #2 and #3 spark plugs so that way the #2 would be grey and to black so I could see if there was any change. I also verified that the #2 spark Plug was firing off the #3 coil to make sure the coil pack wasn't the problem - When I got back the #2 spark plug which was grey was starting to go black, and it was definetely wet, but I don't think it was gas. (the smell of Gas wasn't there, or at least wasn't the smell of pure gas like when you pull and injector)

The #3 spark plug was still black as hell but I never got on it, and was just a quick off boost drive around the 2 building that are adjacent to mine.

I also cleaned off the Valve cover throughly that way I can see where the oil is coming from. And at idle it started to collect on the inside of the spark plug well, on the bottom bolt closest to the cam gear cover. I want to let you guys know that the Valve cover bolts on the outside row closest to the Cam gear cover do not tighten down. The threads must be stripped But I haven't messed with it to see if I can re-tap the holes. But all the inside sparkplug well bolts, and every other outside Valve cover bolts tighten down, which is why I haven't messed with it didn't think it would be an issue, and wasn't an issue till all this started happening.

I checked the torque of the Head studs all of them are/where tighened to 100ft/lbs (as John said they should be) and all the valve springs/rockers, etc all looked to be in place and operating correctly I saw nothing out of place.

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

Not that this is topic related but I've been trying to mess with my HP calculations and I'm wondering why is it that my HP changes so much through out a pull?

If you have DSMLINK Set up so that it show's HP and Torque, with these settings.

3325(car+my weight) with my tire size 220/40/18, and everything else default. and apply it, why does my HP change so much through out the run. I'm assuming/hoping it's because of the problem I'm having.

But say on my 12.9 run my HP goes anywhere from 236HP all the way up to 396HP even though my Lbs/min, my G/Rev all seem to be holding pretty well. For most of the run the HP sits around 330hp which would make sense for a traps around 106-108mph like I did. Could it be that when the HP jumps up that the cylinder or what ever is firing at that time?

**JET** · 10-01-2005

I saw this recently on someone else's engine. Could your intake manifold gasket be bent over and in one of the runners? It should show up on the boost leak test you did though. Another thing to try would be swapping injectors to see if that changes what cylinder gets black. Maybe it is sticking open?

SlowWhite · 10-01-2005

Alreayd tried that. I swapped the #1 and the #2 cylinder injectors and it didn't change anything.

also forget the HP thing, cause if I used those settings on my logs of when I dyno'd 403 and 456 It said I was putting down 600 something and 700. Which might be because one is a street application and the other is dyno. However at least on the dyno logs the HP continues to increase for the most part where as on my latest logs they go up and down through out the entire run.

Outlaw1 · 10-02-2005

Just a long shot, but worth a look. Does your intake manifold have a vacuum source on the #2 runner? Do you have that line running to the fuel pressure regulator? If you pull that hose off does it have fuel in it? Just something to look at it, you might have a busted diaphram in the regulator.

SlowWhite · 10-02-2005

actually I'm pretty sure that all 4 of my vacuum lines are running between my #2 and #3 runners with my vacuum line for the fuel closest to the #2 runner

I'll have to go out and check here in a minute

SlowWhite · 10-02-2005

Ok yes my fuel vacuum line and my Brake booster line are plumped right infront of my #2 runner, however when I pulled the lines (ie: everyline attached to the Regulator) No fuel came out. the only one I didn't pull was the fuel return line

SlowWhite · 10-02-2005

Is there anything special I need to be doing when installing the CAS once I've pulled it out to test if the injectors are firing? I pulled it way back when I first posted about my fuel pump wire coming loose. And all I did was just stick it back in the socket and re-tighten... Was there an alignement or something I was supposed to do... Like install it when a cylinder is Top dead Center and when it's set for a certain sequence of firing?

Alpine TSi · 10-02-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by SlowWhite

Is there anything special I need to be doing when installing the CAS once I've pulled it out to test if the injectors are firing? I pulled it way back when I first posted about my fuel pump wire coming loose. And all I did was just stick it back in the socket and re-tighten... Was there an alignement or something I was supposed to do... Like install it when a cylinder is Top dead Center and when it's set for a certain sequence of firing?

Well if you didn't get it in the EXACT same position, you will have to redo your timing. And just as long as you didn't get it 180 degrees out.

SlowWhite · 10-02-2005

How who'd I know?

all i did was take it out and then spin it by hand with the key in the on position, so that I could hear the injectors firing/fuel pump kicking on.

Then I just put it back in, and tightened it down. I know I got the actual CAS positioned correctly but not sure if there is a firing sequence or something, (ie: I'd have to spin it till it got to the #1 injector or something like that)

I really don't know much about it other then I quickly glanced over a post on dsmlink forums where they said you have to get the #1 cylinder to top dead center and then install it, but didn't quite get more then that out of the thread.

I'm actually thinking about pulling the fuel rail and the CAS so that I can spin it by hand and see if the injectors are firing,etc.

I'm really out of ideas here on what the hell could be going on? what else could it possibly by I've tried Fuel, I've tried spark, the only thing I can't test as far as I know is "AIR"