FattyBoomBatty
06-21-2008, 09:09 AM
Sadly I will be in Canada for a race Saturday. Talk to Brian next time you come up, I would be interested to talk to you about some of the things we have been disscussing that's 2.4 related.
Dave figured out that with a square tube primary, you have more surface area than with a round priamary. Kinda like a kicker square solo baric sub woofer vs a round one. Using a square tube you can use a smaller primary for the those tighter areas and still have the same volume that a larger round pipe would use. He also figured out that with a tight bend in a round pipe the exhaust starts to "roll" over itself and begins to spiral, slowing the exhaust speed. With a square tube, it doesnt spiral and actually the tighter the bend the better. On the inside of the bend exhaust speeds will actually increase and draw the exhaust out.
He has huge patents on anything automotive related that uses a square tube for exhaust, etc. Currentley he works with chevrolet and ford using this technology and you will also see his square tube headers allot in dirt track racing. Look at a new corvette, cast square tube exhaust manifolds.
Any way, sorry to wander off the subject
This is by Archertsi, who knows nothing about fluid dynamics or corvette exhaust manifolds.
Look at this picture, LS2 (new corvette engine) exhaust manifold next to some aftermarket header. Yes, I know there's a head shield on it, but it uses ROUND tubing for the little runners. From the factory, because it's better.
http://images.highperformancepontiac.com/tech/0706_hppp_03_z+ls2_power_package+exhaust_manifold. jpg
Meow, that dummy who told Mr. Archertsi that square tubing flows more air that round, especially in an extremely tight radius bend apparently works for DPengineering, who obviously don't engineer anything at all.
I am not a mechanical engineer, but I did spend two years at college for it, and can list many, if not hundreds of examples where square tubing would not only not fit, but inhibit air or exhaust flow more than round tubing, while adding unnecessary weight.
Look, if you will, for any measure of time, at a jet engine. Take a brand new engine from a boeing 777, perhaps the pinacle of current jet engine technology, at least when it rolled out, not but a few years ago.
http://www.rolls-royce.com/civil_aerospace/images/photos/trent800_cut.jpg
Do you see anything remotely square about that design? Why do you think that is, Archertsi? It's because air flows better through a round tube than a square tube. If you really want, I can spend some time looking up air mass properties in a tube vs. a square, but I'll ask you to try first.
Also, just to make sure I wouldn't make a fool of myself (unless you were joking, in which case, I am a fool for reacting to what you said), I searched for a while for pictures or stories about square tube exhaust headers. Couldn't find any. If they are so good, and he's got deals with ford and chevy, why might I not find anything about it? I checked here: http://www.circletrack.com/enginetech/index.html and found an article comparing headers, none of which were square. Anyone who patents something in the automotive field and doesn't have it purchased by an auto manufacturer or an oil company must not have a very good product.
Dave figured out that with a square tube primary, you have more surface area than with a round priamary. Kinda like a kicker square solo baric sub woofer vs a round one. Using a square tube you can use a smaller primary for the those tighter areas and still have the same volume that a larger round pipe would use. He also figured out that with a tight bend in a round pipe the exhaust starts to "roll" over itself and begins to spiral, slowing the exhaust speed. With a square tube, it doesnt spiral and actually the tighter the bend the better. On the inside of the bend exhaust speeds will actually increase and draw the exhaust out.
He has huge patents on anything automotive related that uses a square tube for exhaust, etc. Currentley he works with chevrolet and ford using this technology and you will also see his square tube headers allot in dirt track racing. Look at a new corvette, cast square tube exhaust manifolds.
Any way, sorry to wander off the subject
This is by Archertsi, who knows nothing about fluid dynamics or corvette exhaust manifolds.
Look at this picture, LS2 (new corvette engine) exhaust manifold next to some aftermarket header. Yes, I know there's a head shield on it, but it uses ROUND tubing for the little runners. From the factory, because it's better.
http://images.highperformancepontiac.com/tech/0706_hppp_03_z+ls2_power_package+exhaust_manifold. jpg
Meow, that dummy who told Mr. Archertsi that square tubing flows more air that round, especially in an extremely tight radius bend apparently works for DPengineering, who obviously don't engineer anything at all.
I am not a mechanical engineer, but I did spend two years at college for it, and can list many, if not hundreds of examples where square tubing would not only not fit, but inhibit air or exhaust flow more than round tubing, while adding unnecessary weight.
Look, if you will, for any measure of time, at a jet engine. Take a brand new engine from a boeing 777, perhaps the pinacle of current jet engine technology, at least when it rolled out, not but a few years ago.
http://www.rolls-royce.com/civil_aerospace/images/photos/trent800_cut.jpg
Do you see anything remotely square about that design? Why do you think that is, Archertsi? It's because air flows better through a round tube than a square tube. If you really want, I can spend some time looking up air mass properties in a tube vs. a square, but I'll ask you to try first.
Also, just to make sure I wouldn't make a fool of myself (unless you were joking, in which case, I am a fool for reacting to what you said), I searched for a while for pictures or stories about square tube exhaust headers. Couldn't find any. If they are so good, and he's got deals with ford and chevy, why might I not find anything about it? I checked here: http://www.circletrack.com/enginetech/index.html and found an article comparing headers, none of which were square. Anyone who patents something in the automotive field and doesn't have it purchased by an auto manufacturer or an oil company must not have a very good product.