MegaSquirt (MS) Custom Builds (interest?)

[Andrew7dg]

As for a little introduction, my name is Andrew and I have been getting interested in standalones ever since I wanted to switch to bigger injectors. At the time it seemed like the best way to take control over instead of fooling (AFC) the stock ECU. I have built one for my car (1990 Eclipse GSX) and it has been a great program to tune with. My goal is to share this tuning tool to the rest of the community and show what possibilities it has to offer.

The hardware that I have used is MS components, which is a DIY build ECU. It is meant to keep cost down instead of paying $1000 for a standalone from an aftermarket. This has been a great resource for people who are on a budget or for cars that don’t have strong aftermarket support. The reason why it is cheap is because you order just the board and components and solder the components to the board. In essence you are building your own ECU!

This soldering and lack of “plug and play” I believe has damaged the reputation of MS systems. There are horror stories of how people have jumbled the install and burned components on the board or destroyed components on the car. However I am offering to set everything up for people for the reassurance of having the system built properly.

Brief overview of MS boards and features can be found on the link below.

http://www.msextra.com/feature-xref.html

There is a wealth of information out there on this system that would be overwhelming to put into this thread. However I would like to try to simplify it as much as possible for the application. I have done my homework and can answer questions that people have.

For people who have Non mitsu engines, this is not limited to 4g63. I could construct MS standalones for other cars like 420a engine found in 2nd gen.

Here is a list of some of the cars that MS has proven to worked on.

Chrysler/Dodge/Mitsu
SOHC 3.0
K-car derived cars (Daytona, LeBaron, Shadow, Sundance, minivans, and other applications) as well as in the Mitsubishi Diamante and various Mitsubishi trucks.

DSM/Mitsubishi
420a
4g63 1st and 2nd gen
4g37
4g15
6g72

Ford
Probe GT from 1993-1997
5.0L Mustangs from 1986-1995
4.6L Mustangs from 1996-2004
2.3L Turbo and non turbo

Honda/Acura
1992-2002- anything

Mazda
RX-7 1986-1991
Miata 1990-1997
MX6 or 626 1993-1997 (v6 engines)

Nissan/Datsun
240sx – KA powerd
280ZX turbo- 1982-1983

Subaru
RX Turbo 1987

Toyota
4AGE/4AGTE
22RE/22RTE

VW
8 valve and 16 valve inline four
V6

Volvo

240/740/940

BMW
3 series inline 4 or 6

There are also custom boards (not nessesarly MS specific) that I could construct.

P&H driver board
This is for people who don’t have or want to replace their resistor pack. Use with low-z injectors
V1.1 To be used inside of the MS case

V2.0 Could be used with its own case




“This board allows the use of low-z injectors without any resistors and without setting up any PWM parameter since the chip (LM1949) the board is based on takes care of setting the current correctly no matter what the battery voltage is or what injector is there.

However, these drivers can only handle a single injector so the board can be used for engines with up to 4 injectors. For more injectors, more boards can be used.” -jbperf

Untested by myself you could put in hi-z injectors and still be fine.

I have one installed on my car for full sequential injection.

MS3- is in testing phase right now. There is a lot of talk about what its features are going to be but it should be a high quality chip able to control lots of features. It will also offer data logging capabilities without having a computer plugged into it.
*I don’t have any experience with MS3 because the chip is only out to a select few people to alpha and beta test.

Another feature of MS that is over look (and some MS people still working with megatune) is that Tuner Studio is out for MS that is a real user-friendly program developed for MS. This has greatly simplified the Megatune Program and has
Screen Shots







The same tuning techniques/principles that get applied to MAP based ECUs is the same technique that gets used with these MS systems. Since the program is user friendly and simple MAP based, tuners that have access to dynos should be able to tune them with ease.


To make home tuning easier. The Creators of Tuner studio also produced a VE table analyzer program Mega Log Viewer





VE Table Tuning
MSQ File Table Editing
Auto Update - check here for more info on Auto update
Scale change, up to 8x zoom
Playback from 1/8 speed to 8x speed
Overlayed Graphs
Compare mode - Overlay second file values
Wideband O2 - AFR calculations
Calculated Fields - RPM/Sec, Vacuum, Boost, PW-1. See Math Parser
Frame to table Cell display
Mass Air Flow mapping
Custom Formulas with free hand math
Save Graph to Jpeg for easy posting to web
Customizable colors, gauges and UI features.
User friendly interface that saves all settings and enables navigation by keyboard, buttoms and mouse.
Text Math Parser for custom extensions and fields


So in short I am offering to assemble the MS systems for you and even make them Plug and Play ready (or as close as possible depending on application). All that would be needed is to run a vacuum line like you would for a boost gauge. I use a patch harness to tap into the existing harness and on my eclipse, I have never cut a stock wire (well once to repair a connection plug).

[Ihearrtdsm]

I would be interested around late summer/fall.

[Kevin 1G Drummer]

I may be interested in something for the 240 when I get around to turboing it.

[turbotalon1g]

They make these for sweet eagle wagons too.

What about Dodge T3 and T2 cars?

[Andrew7dg]

Originally Posted by Ihearrtdsm

I would be interested around late summer/fall.

I will put together a checklist of options you may want/don't want that you could look at so you can plan for this.

Originally Posted by Kevin 1G Drummer

I may be interested in something for the 240 when I get around to turboing it.

There are multiple people on the forums that use MS standalones on their KA motors (and SR20de and det because I am guessing some ecus do not come with the imported engines) . I am not familiar with the stock ECU setup but I am guessing that it is just not up to the task of handling the engine with a turbo on it.

Originally Posted by turbotalon1g

They make these for sweet eagle wagons too.

What about Dodge T3 and T2 cars?

There are success stories of Daytona Turbo 2 and 3 (I believe thats the car you are referring to) and Turbo Dodge Omni. I can pretty much take control of almost anything with a distributor and after that figuring out fuel injection will be a breeze.

[Kevin 1G Drummer]

Yeah, from what I understand the stock KA ecu is fine up to 7 or 8 psi or about 250whp, but my goals are much higher than that. I'm shooting for +20psi and ~400whp

[1QUICK4]

I talked to you about building a box for my Chevelle when you were over picking up the Scummit.

Definetly want!

[turbotalon1g]

Originally Posted by Kevin 1G Drummer

Yeah, from what I understand the stock KA ecu is fine up to 7 or 8 psi or about 250whp, but my goals are much higher than that. I'm shooting for +30psi and ~400whp

Fix.t

[slowbubblecar]

Do you happen to know if many of the local shops have experience tuning with it?

[Andrew7dg]

Originally Posted by Kevin 1G Drummer

Yeah, from what I understand the stock KA ecu is fine up to 7 or 8 psi or about 250whp, but my goals are much higher than that. I'm shooting for +20psi and ~400whp

The MAP Daddy sensor that is offered is a 4 bar sensor (44 psi) and has a second sensor for altitude correction. This is what I have and it works flawless.


Here is the sensor that you have. One is a 360 and the other is a 4. You really only need the 4 ring for the MS to work properly.

Originally Posted by 1QUICK4

I talked to you about building a box for my Chevelle when you were over picking up the Scummit.

Definetly want!

There are a lot of different ways to do a 350 chev!
If you are going with a simple HEI distributor, it will be very easy to take control of spark.

The fueling option are TPI or TBI or just a custom direct port injection manifold.

I have been installing a 350 chev in an S-10 (for way too long and it is about time I just get that project done!) and I plan on going with E85 sometime with higher compression. A complete setup will be installed on that.

[turbotalon1g]

Can we get some more info on this MAP sensor and altitude sensor?

[Andrew7dg]

Originally Posted by slowbubblecar

Do you happen to know if many of the local shops have experience tuning with it?

Around here, no
In other parts of the country, yes

However if the tuner knows how to tune a map based VE table and Spark table (which is also used by other standalone ECUs) the tuner should be able to tune using Tuner Studio. It is a really EASY program to work with. Very quick if you know the hot keys.

I will be glad to bring my car in somewhere so that they would gain experience. I have the program on my laptop and just a run around the block should be enough for the experience and figure out the functions.

Once I figured out how all of this work I learned that ECUs are built pretty much all the same.

It is like a stereo system. There are Inputs/ and there are Outputs
Then all you have to do is just figure out how the car breaths

HOWEVER for the spark tuning, i highly recommend bringing it to a steady state dyno to get the spark dialed in. That really can't be done on the road.

[Andrew7dg]

Originally Posted by turbotalon1g

Can we get some more info on this MAP sensor and altitude sensor?

From DIYautotune


Fits on the board like this


And this is what you have to run a manifold pressure line to


It is just 2 map sensors. One reads the pressure in the manifold and the other one reads the outside atmosphere pressure.

Really we would need just one because our state is pretty flat. You would usually use this when traveling up and down mountains where the pressure would greatly change to the point that it throws off the ECU.

[Andrew7dg]

SO BIG!!!

[Shane@DBPerformance]

I have tuned Megasquirt cars and I am pretty sure most of the shops in town have.

[turbotalon1g]

Yeah megasquirt is pretty common and has been around for years, its just that DSMers have a lot of other choices.

[Andrew7dg]

Originally Posted by turbotalon1g

Yeah megasquirt is pretty common and has been around for years, its just that DSMers have a lot of other choices.

It has been around for a while but not to this level. MSII came out not that long ago is a lot more advanced then MSI. MSIII is just around the corner which is WAY more advance then any of the previous versions.

I wouldn't feel comfortable offering MSI as a standalone. It is pretty primitive. However, I don't think many people realize MSII capability for a standalone ECU because it is still fairly new. It was brand new when I installed it onto my car and there were only a handful of DSM running on MSII at the time. Then tunerstudio came out and made things so much more user friendly. Thats why I am offering to help assemble and offer this to people.

Now MSIII is just around the corner. I can't wait to see the possibilities with that system. It is evolving from a computer programmer ECU to a user Friendly system in a very short amount of time.

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