Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Well, since the car challenge thread is getting polluted with school and degree questions, lets just argue that stuff here.

Personally, I have a secondary education from Dunwoody welding and I wouldn't do it again. It never effected my income ever in that field. I have no formal education in automotive which has also not effected that income and I made 80K and turned down jobs for 6 figures in network administration for about ten years. All self tought. If you know what you are doing it in most tech fields and can represent yourself correctly, you do not have to have a degree. So it isn't required. I have hired and fired more college educated idiots than you can imagine. Is that the law and does it apply to everyone, no. If you have natural talent and go to school, you will likely be better off. If you have no natural talent and go to school, you could end up getting in the door of many jobs and find yourself out of work a month later when they realize your capabilities.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

I do not belive a degree is necessary. If i had to do it over again, i dont think i would go to school.
I know i could be doing the same thing, making the same money, at the same place, if i didnt have anything.
How i would acually get a job, im not sure. if you are going to be working for someone, it may be necessary. if you venture out yourself, you are fine.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Speaking in the tech field, I don't really believe it is necesary to hold a degree, but for the majority of the remaining job fields, I think it is. Many jobs won't even consider you unless you meet their requirements, IE a degree. In order to 'represent yourself' without a degree, you'd have to be extremmely talented AND pretty lucky. Even though you may constantly get fired, having a degree at least gives you the oppertunity to get in the door in the first place.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Depends on who you are and what kind of job your going for.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

do you NEED a degree these days? the simple answer is no. though some of us have aspirations that can't be attained WITHOUT a degree.

i live a very comfortable life in a middle class family, all provided by my parents. neither of them have college degrees, but decades of expierience in their respective fields. they have from day one told me they would help me out in any way they could towards getting a college degree. why is that? because at their jobs, advancing beyond a certain point requires that expensive piece of paper that says " i worked hard to get this, and i should be paid accordingly." at some places degrees mean nothing, and at others it is in the company policy exactly how far a non-collegiate can go on the ladder

some kids choose to get degrees that are worth almost nothing. things like: communications, philosophy, dance, etc. spending your money on shit like that is a waste.

i choose engineering (mechanical) as my major, and to be honest its hard as fuck. calc, physics, statics, dynamics, electrical networks, differential equations, the damn list goes on and on. NONE of these classes can be just cruised through, you have to study and work at it way more than you want to. but you know what? when you get through it all (eventually) you have a degree in something useful and unique. you know you won't be making a living off of your back and knuckles, and the base pay is outstanding.

to sum it up, if you have goals and the drive to do something with your life, yes a degree is a good idea. if you don't really care what you do as long as you have enough $$ to just chill back and enjoy life, then its probably not for you :)

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

You can fulfill a good life without a degree but depending on goals and what field ou want to work in you might need one to even step in the door unless your uncles step brother is the owner. I see many places requiring degrees in the future that people would not dream needing a degree.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Well as stated at the beginning of this, I have made decent money and turned down an income of 120K a year because my wife at the time didn't want to sell our house in Cambridge and move to Bursnville, she was more content with me driving that far each day. The position required me to be that close to respond to network issues quicker. When I turned it down, I left my Job at 80K because I didn't want to deal with people I had once hired being above me. The owner of that business was not a friend or relative or otherwise and Network administration and Unix administration requires a lot of knowledge. It doesn't have to come from school if you can back up what you claim. 4 years after I started working there, I went and took the Cisco Certification tests and had no trouble passing them with almost perfect scores. They were not needed and none of the people I worked for as a consultant after that or was ever employed by cared about the Certs. So paper is not always required. I started a welding and machine shop when i was 22 that in it's first year did 335K in business, owned it for 3.5 years and sold it. Point of that is that you can have high goals and not need a degree to attain them. I quite going to Dunwoody for welding after the first year as it wasn't teaching me anything beyond what I knew and the degree didn't matter.

Of course I don't think everyone in the same situations would do the same, but I do stand by the fact that a degree is far from a requirement to get a good high paying job without laying on your back scraping your knuckles. It also doesn't preclude you from making a very good living. I would venture a guess that the majority of successful CEO's in this country did not hold any degrees before they started their companies.

I would actually say getting a degree is a bit like following a recipe for performance with a DSM. You can do it with the right amount of time and money, it is clearly defined and well proven to work if you follow through and when you are done, you will be about the same as everyone else who also followed the "recipe". The guys that break records and turn heads are at the front of the pack from pioneering ways to go faster, creative people with proper motivation etc. Similar to those who invent products, start companies etc.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

A degree is well worth the money these days. A degree gives you more options in life. Which for me is something I need/want. Expect the worst, hope for the best seems to come to mind.

As for the whole UTI vs. wyotech. I have seen where wyotech is and let me tell you that not a lot of people could handel it out there. In fact I have met numerous people that went to wyotech and now goto UTI. Why did they come to UTI after wyotech. Well I have heard a couple of different answer. One is the area. Sapposedly there is nothin to do and its riddled with very red necks. The girls will ride you. The big one was the way they teach though. Fast and not very direct/detailed. The one thing that got them all was, the hype.

Good points to wyotech are: Cheap, Out in the middle of nowhere (some people like that). 8 hour days (cram 8 hours of info in a day wouldn't be to bad. Also used to mimic a working day).

All of my info is based off of what students at UTI have said. Also a instructer.

So for any of you future auto technicians I would highly recommend UTI to anyone trying to set themselfs apart from the rest.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Instead of goind to a technical school, you guys should go back to 1st grade and learn how to spell correctly.Even with the best schooling on your resume, if you spell like a 5 year old, you're not getting the job.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

its all going to be just like that. I've been told be a student that went to uti that it sucked there as well. Yes the town blows!!! it plain and simple sucks I wont dissagree. It helps you focus on school. they dont cram things down your skull, but they get the lessons done and they do it well. They are very direct and detailed. The only want students dont get it is if they dont pay attention which half the Kids don't.. I have stayed above 90% my whole stay here and its been hard at times but if you pay attention in class, and ask questions you can do alright. I also have had a long long time of experience. I've been under the hood of cars since I was about 8 years old with my old man. He was a master ase certified tech for years! It surely does help having him around and he tought me a lot well before I made my selection of school and profession. Hes now a St. Paul fight fighter because well lets face it being a tech KILL's your body. I would come back here anytime. plus its free to return anytime you want.

Kevin

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Well, one thing I would say is whatever school you are going to, you should be doing everything you can to learn all they have to offer and if the instructors will let you do more, go fo it. That would seem obvious, but most people don't do it. The degree won't matter if you can't impress them with the work you can do, regardless of what big name school you go to. Don't limit yourself to what they teach and in fact question everything that isn't perfectly clear or logical. Instructors in any school are not perfect, if they don't maintain an open mind to ideas you may have, you should be careful of them. A true sign of knowledge is realizing you can learn from anyone. Most of the instructors I have met over the years were too closed minded and set in their ways for me to trust.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Very well put Mike! I couldn't agree more. I ask questions and make sure I understand the logic, and everything I'm learning to the fullest!

Kevin

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Thats a good point.Too often the education you receive is heavily biased by the educators.The best education comes from when you learn by your own means, at your own rate.You can learn more grabbing some tools and going at it for a day, than you could spending a month in school.

I don't even have a high school diploma, and I don't feel disadvantaged in the least.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

I would say that a degree is not necissary but doesn't ever hurt. Some trade jobs do not matter if you have a degree or not. I will be finishing my general 2 year degree at the end of this semester. I am VERY happy I am going to college. I have learned a lot or knowledge in just the two years. In HS, I was the kid who didn't really give a shit. I hardly squeaked out a B average to get on the Honor Role. I will be graduating with High Honors this year (3.5+ GPA). For the first time in my life, I achieved strait A's last semester taking 17 credits and working on average 35 hours per week.

In college, I started taking classes I cared about and studied my ass off. I have learned a lot about business, accounting, economics, and other classes I had no interest in before. I am very interested in them now. I was never a reader and dreaded a reading assignment in class all through my life. I have now read a few books due to general interest (The Millionaire Next Door and Rich Dad Poor Dad to name a couple).

Just the two years I have taken in general college courses at Normandale has changed my whole career path. I planned on being an accountant and making a decent amount of money sitting behind a desk all day. I was a very quiet person who seemed to go with the flow. You all know that has changed quite a bit ;)

I now am dead set on owning my own business. I love meeting new people and gaining a greater understanding of the world. I am most likely going to quit my job soon at ACE when my back heals to get a sales job so I can improve my selling and persuasion skills. I will probly get an internship in the summer and possibly start up a very small business. I am only looking to start a company with a very low overhead. Right now, I am contemplating desicions for next year. I may apply to transfer to the Carlson School of Management. Very good school and very expensive (would put me in great debt. I have paid my way so far but no way I could keep up.)

I have to decide weather I have solid grounds to open my own business or go to college. College is going to put me way into the hole but in will better my chances in becoming a better euntreprenuer. If I did not go to school and complete my MBA, I could have made a lot of money.

Most people come out of college in great debt (obviously) and a person who jumps strait into the workforce can start building a net worth. I have to decide.

The decision of college is an important one that should not be taken lightly by anyone. We are in a changing world. Our partents did not need an education when they grew up. My mom for example has worked at her job for 35 years now :O . We are in a time where the average american will change their career 5-6 times before they retire. A college degree is required for most any postion now. Although it has benifited me greatly, I will admit it is not for everyone.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Needing a degree depends on what field you go into. You have to look at it in the long run. While you are in school, you could be out in your field getting experience and making money instead of spending it. In the beginning experience means more than a degree in most fields. I was a machinist making very good money ($23.50/hr), but I never went to school for that (I started at mechanical engineer, then went to business management). I just excelled in my field and learned things quickly.

If you are looking to go up the corporate ladder, the best way would be to start a job right away after high school at an entry level job and start going to school part time. You are not going to get very high up in a company without experience and an education. Do you think someone would get promoted with a degree and 6 years of experience or a person with a degree and 2 years of experience? It does end up costing a little more that way though because you won't get as much financial aid.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Jet, it depends. If you went to school right away, you would finish sooner. That would give you an extra 2 years to get on your feet with only college experience. If you wanted to be a manager, you could spend a year managing at McDonalds and then have some managerial experience when looking for a higher up job.

An entery level job as an intern is not much for experience. The advantage to taking an entery level job is that you can get your foot in the door. Hope that they will have a position there for you when you are finished with school. Most entry level business jobs are secretaries or some other bitch position (hope I didn't offend any secretaries).

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Alot of CEO's started in bitch positions.Its either years of hard work in college or years of hard work at the job, I believe either way you end up at the same point.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

I believe you can make it both ways. There are a lot of things you learn going to college that you would not have learned in getting the job. There are also a lot of things you can learn on the job that you will never learn in school. On cars for example: everything is possible. You just have to have the time and the courage to attack problems and learn them on your own. I started from the ground up 4 years ago. My parents/friends had no interest in cars. I never thought I would get to the point of pulling 5 heads, 4 motors, and 1 tranny in one year.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

Just to prove that your education leads to money thing is mostly bs, I was making somewhere north of 40K(at the age of 20) with no education other than a high school diploma. And it wasn't a labor based job either, I managed a retail department. And I wasn't the only one in that field making that much. Now yes, I wish it had been a stable position, but that was all on me. And yes I am planning to go back to school for a degree, but will I make anymore money than where I was before? Probably not. I could try and go up the ladder where I am now and make the same again, but I think it is time to move on.

Re: Is a degree necessary? Debate on that here.
 

One other thing, where you get a degree from really doesn't mean shit. Most companies look at it where a degree is a degree. My Ex was convinced that she would get a better job because she went to a private college costing $18k/yr. She ended up making $12.50/hr answering calls in a customer service department. In a large company like Wells Fargo, they usually have a cap on how high you could move up w/o a degree. She could have spend her 2 years working at the entry level while going to school, then move up one level (the top w/o a degree) and be there for the 6 years you needed to to move up to the next level and gotten her degree. She would have had 4 more years of experience at the same point in her life.

Like I said though, it depends on the job, but this applies to most. A mechanical engineer? Get a job as a machinist then go to school. The experience you gain from being a machinist is invaluable. It works like that in most jobs, but not all.