Winter/Performance
 

I did some searching in regards to this topic but really couldn't find anything that was current; and since tire technology and types change constantly I figured I would just post another thread.

Winter is coming soon and I am looking around for some performance/winter tires for my GTP. I have a new Chevy Tahoe but still need to get around with the car if I need to.

Anyway; what is out there that is decent? I don't really want Blizzaks because they are not stable enough and wear out too fast.

As of now I am torn between either: Michelin Pilot Alpin PA2 or Dunlop SP Winter Sport M3. They are both around $100 each from Tirerack.

I know there some more really expensive odd brands out there for snow tires that are awesome but I wanted to stay in the $100 per tire range and I don't want some General Tire hunk of shit either.

Any advice?

Re: Winter/Performance
 

The Winter Sport M3 tires are good, my dad has those on his GTO and the car goes just fine in the snow/ice, plus they handle better in the dry than the stock high-performance all-seasons did. I have Hankook W300's on the Evo for winter and I'm impressed with those as well.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I know you said you didn't want General but I have General Artic Altimax on my Summit. They were great in the winter and have lasted all summer too lol.
Probably only lost 1/32-2/32 over the year even beating the shi out of them in the summer.

http://images.fourwheeler.com/techar...max_arctic.jpg

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I have the Winter sport M3's and they very well last winter, i got a deal on them used... otherwise i would have gotten the general altimax

Re: Winter/Performance
 

Scheides just bought those Generals for his Evo. I'm sure they're a good snow tire, but definitely no "performance" to them. I wouldn't want to lose my good handling for half the year.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

Yup, the performance in the Altimax's is definitely not going to be in handling, it will be in climbing through any snowpile I want! Kracka seems to imply that my car will also loose its power, brakes, and steering wheel once I put these tires on...I don't think they're going to be *that* bad!

I think I only ran my winter tires (I had all-seasons last year) for about 3.5 months. It was very early december when I put them on and mid march when I took them off. Wonder what this year will be like? :)

For a good handling snow tire, I say go with the W300's. They handle decent and work good in the snow.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I looked at them but they weren't rated as good as the ones I mentioned; but I did see that quite a few people ran them with ok results. I really don't care a ton about precise handling because my car is not for that anyway; but I don't want to feel like I am driving on balloons either.

And the Altimax's will make your engine blow up; Hughes knows his tires....

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I've had Hankook Icebears on my Evo two winters now and don't regret the purchase, was the cheapest snow tire at the time.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I know you said you don't want blizzaks, but i use these Blizzak lm-25's and man are they sweet. I have two seasons on them right now and they still have alot of tread life left.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....=Blizzak+LM-25

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I've run Blizzak's and Yokohama Iceguards. Far and away the Yoko's were the best. Fantastic ice traction and we could get through any snow. Seemed to keep their tread a bit longer too.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

Back when I had my 240sx I had the Hankook W300's on it, and they were great. I never had a problem getting out of a snow bank with those.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

from 3si.org
And now to what the tires were really meant for. The fun stuff, snow and ice.

I did a lot of searching to decide what snow/winter tires to get and based my decisions on several things, 2 of which were the October '05 Swedish aftonbladet winter tires tests and '05 winter tire testing by a Norwegian auto magazine:
http://www.motor.no/pdf/044-50_Mo08_LR1.pdf

Both reviews ranked the top 3 winter tires as these, with scores of 8.3 Continental Viking Winter Contact 3 (not available in N. America), 8.2 Gislaved SoftFrost 2, and 8.1 Nokian Hakkapeliitta Rsi. Reviewing the actual test data, it appears that the Nokian excels in acceleration while the other 2 are slightly better in braking, but the Conti's aren't available in the US and the Gislaveds don't come in 18" sizes, so the Nokian's were an easy choice. 4th place was the Michelin X-Ice with a score of 7.8. Blizzak WS-50's only scored 6.3 and were considered 'unsafe' on wet/dry asphalt.

True to the testing, these tires accelerate like a bat out of hell with the AWD. It's almost like the snow/ice isn't there. Yes, I can break the tires loose
but the amount of grip is just incredible. Likewise, braking grip is incredibly good. So much so that on snow/ice, I'm now only concerned with the ability of anyone behind me stopping in time. Much better turn in as well. And pushing the car on the snow late at night with no one else around revealed that the tires give incredible control when drifting.

The Nokians are popular with the skiing community in Vermont and Colorado and also very popular in street tire class snow rallying. In snow and ice racing, drivers have commented on the fact that these tires recover quickly from skidding/drifting (some tires don't want to stop sliding once they start). The tire tread was supposedly designed to actually regain grip very quickly after sliding/drifting while retaining good grip and directional control while drifting. If you'ld like to try being Tommi Makinen, these tires might be a good start. Braking drift, lift-throttle oversteer, power oversteer and the Scandinavian flick were all a joy with these tires (but you'll have to push a little harder to upset the grip of course).

Another selling point for me is the fact that these tires have been found to wear much better than the Bridgestone Blizzak WS-50's. The WS-50 uses Bridgestone's soft Multicell compound to provide its snow/ice grip, but the compound is only half the tread depth, and wears quickly. User reviews have stated that once the Blizzak's multicell compound has worn away, the tire is no better than any cheap all-season, and when at full tread depth, block squirm leads to an unstable feeling on bare asphalt.

The Nokian tires have its special rubber compound for the full tread depth and uses innovative tread design to allow the tread block to remain stable on bare asphalt at full depth, and to retain effective sipes for snow/ice grip even when worn down to near legal limits (2/32nds). Users have found that they could get more than double to triple the mileage of the Blizzaks while still retaining the snow/ice performance with the Nokians. At roughly the same price for the same sizes, it's a no-brainer with more than double the longevity and better performance.

I absolutely recommend these tires for anyone looking for winter performance. I've already begun recommending them to friends looking for snow tires. They aren't the cheapest available snow tires around, but when I decided to go with snows in winter and summer tires for the summer I figured I might as well look for the best in both. Aside from the price, (about $100 more per set of 4 than the Blizzaks or Michelin's X-Ice) the one downside is availability. I've heard that these are easy to find in Vermont and Colorado(?) but elsewhere, they're not easily available. The best price I could find was on ebay by userID fastlanetires. Great prices and excellent to deal with. This guy lists the Nokians more or less every other week, but you can email him and ask if you need them in a hurry.

For anyone looking for performance winter tires that can actually be used for all seasons and for more bare asphalt driving, try checking out the Nokian WR series. As far as I know, Nokian WR's are the only all-season tires currently rated for severe winter service (with the mountain and snowflake emblem). The M/S M+S rating has NO requirements that need to be met. Any tire manufacturer can designate any tire in their lineup with a certain minimum void percentage as an M+S without having to meet any winter condition performance requirements. The severe winter service rating actually has winter performance requirements that must be met to earn the rating.


Max

***edited to add*** More news on the Gislaved SoftFrost 2 in N. America. They're not available in the US this year, read the post lower down for more info.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

We sell A LOT of Nokian WRs and other models of tires at my work. I have to say, they seem to be an ok tire, BUT... Everytime I have ever mounted a Nokian brand tire, the wheels have extremely bad road force when balanced. The tires do not sit on center with the wheels and are off just slightly, the only way I've gotten them to seat correctly was drive them around re balance the front, rotate tires, drive around, and reblance the new fronts. They suck for that reason.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I think I am going to get the Goodyear Ultra Grip GW3's; they offer one of the highest speed ratings along with great reviews for winter traction without sacrificing performance like the Blizzaks and some others.

I didn't mention that I want to leave these on all year; not switch them out from season to season, but I don't want just a shitty all season tire either. I know that I won't get the tire longevity of a true all season but I am ok with that.

I was considering the Hankook's but I couldn't find a local dealer that sells them nor could I find an online store that sold the W300's in my size.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

Don't some Walmart stores sell those hankooks? Maybe im wrong.

Re: Winter/Performance
 

Discount Tire had Hankook Winter I-Pikes for me (I think they changed the model name). Great winter tires!

Re: Winter/Performance
 

I've used the Dunlop Winter Sport M3s on my Eclipse for the last few years for winter driving. They are an awesome tire. Great snow traction and very good dry traction. They are V rated and perform almost as good as my Z rated summer tires on dry pavement.

later,
Curt