got done putting on my head today. but of course, it don't wanna start. just sits there and cranks over and over. It's rather annoying. Why won't this stupid thing just freakin start. Imma check all the timing crap again tomorrow. We had everything lined up but i guess it never hurts to recheck. im also gunna check the compression and make sure i gotta spark. If anyone has any other ideas then ur free to comment. Im just kinda writing this so once i find the problem, maybe it'll help sumone someday who ran into this same crap.

1) make sure the plugs are getting spark
2) make sure the injectors are firing
3) make sure the timing is properly aligned
4) make sure you got all sensors hooked up (not sure what year your car is)
5) PayPal me money for this advice
6) suck-off Tom, my mouth hurts

well i found my problem. We put the exhaust came in 180 degrees off, we lined up the wrong fuckin timing mark........ so got everything installed the CORRECT way today. And sure enough, won't start. im pretty sure i know what my problem is. Looks like imma need a new head. I have 140 compression in cyl.3, and 0 compression in the other 3. So next time i get free time to work on it, the head is coming off again so i can see what damage we did when we had that exhaust cam off 180. But i also have no spark. but that's not my main concern right now. anywho ya, kinda bummed, but what can i do, i guess ill just become very efficient at removing heads with all this practice.

Have you even attempted to rule out what is causing the 0 compression?

do a leakdown test and find out where everything is going.you'll have a better chance of success if you have an idea of what failed before you start ripping it apart.

ya i was there helping him put everything on and when it didnt start he looked sooo sad i felt bad for him i mean if he was a girl... or i was gay.... i would've given him a hug cause he looked like he could use one...... oh hell i think ill go give him one now anyway

Line up the crank timing mark to zero, then make sure both your cam gear dowels are at 12 o'clock and check your timing marks for alignment. Make sure you use a straightedge lining up the cam marks through the centerline of the bolt. If they're all lined up and you still have no compression, pull the head off and start over.

we did use a straight edge, put cyl #1 at TDC, alligned cam gears, both dowels pointing north, alligned the front balance shaft sprocket thing to the timing mark, made sure the oil pump sprocket was alligned correctly and not 360 degrees off. Nothing more to allign that im aware of. so bent valves is what im thinkin

i do not know how to do a leakdown test. im pretty sure that everything is lined up timing wise. it had good compression before we started this lil project, i don't know what else it could be

Wrong cams? :confused:

cam labeled INT is towards the intake mani, cam labeled EXH is towards the exh manifold.

Alright, if your exhaust cam was off 180 degrees, wouldn't it be trying to open the exhaust valves the same time as the intake? I am guessing they would meet in the middle and bend. I am not positive on this, but it sounds like what would happen to me.

it is just as if it threw the timing belt but its worse because the valves are not free flowing any more and are going to be stuck there so if they want to open and pinstons are in TDC they will be meating each other for lunch and dinner..

-E

i dont think so, cuz the intake and exhaust strokes are not exactly opposite each other. It goes Intake, compression, combustion, exhaust. so if the exhaust cam is 180 off then i would see the exhaust valves opening during the compression stroke. and to me that equals fizzzuked up valves. im not 100% sure of this, but kinda how i figured it

I would guess you bent the valves as well. What year car? I may have a head for you.

its a 91 tsi awd. if u have a head lemme know asap, im about to buy one from sumone else for 150 shipped. doesn't come with lifters or rocker arms, but i can just take them outta my one i got right now. But if u got one that u are SURE is good, no leaking valve stem seals or anything, then lemme know asap man!

Make sure the other one you are buying comes with the cam caps!

Sorry, the only ones I have at the moment are 2G. Like JET said, make sure he at least has the caps for it. Hey, now may be a good time to go with the new style lifters as well. They can be had for a little more than $7 each.

may i ask why cam caps are important? i mean i can take the ones of mine and put it on that one right? or are they like non interchangable? just wondering. I'm pretty sure it comes with the cam caps but ill ask him just to make sure 100%

My money is on bent valves, with probably some piston damage, how many times did you try to crank it? Cause if it cranked multiple times you probably had a valve wedge the piston from moving (not good).
The other option is what is the headgasket made of? Im assuming you used a new one...What did you torque it to?
Also did you perform the test correctly? Possibly a chunk of the tool (o-ring) get stuck down a spark plug hole? How does the motor sound when testing? (air coming out other holes?)
Do a leakdown test, or just rip it off, and keep us posted.
FYI, its not recommended to swap cam caps, just like its not recommended to swap main caps and so forth.

ok well i got a new head coming. Imma just plop the new head on there in place of my fucked up one(that is if there isn't much piston damage, then im in a whole different boat). But the head does come with new cam caps, comes with everything EXCEPT cams. so ill just reuse my old ones i figure. I'm possitive i did the compression test right. I guess if my pistons are jacked up, imma just reuse the big rods and plop some 95 or evo pistons on there real quick, and hopefully everything will work out. HOPEFULLY i don't gotta replace the damn pistons. but whatever happens then ill let ya'll know. i torqued the head to 78ft/lbs with my arp head studs. That is what i was told by someone else that arp recommends as a torque setting. if anyone else knows differently, please chime in. anywho im out

Most people with ARP's go to 90 - 95 ft/lbs. Some get crazy like John and crank them to 105. I run 95 in my car.

ok so u recommend like 90 ft/lbs on my stock headgasket?

I run 110 ft/lbs using oil, doesn't matter what kind of gasket. Although I run a Mitsu metal hg with copper spray. Haven't blown a gasket yet.

ok well i figured id keep u updated using this same thread, so anywho spent a lil over an hour taking the head off. got it off, good news was that the pistons are ok. The rather confusing news, is that the head seems to be fine. I guess i can't see everything, but it looks like its fine. But i swear i had 0 compression in 3 cylinders and 140 in cyl#3. wierd, could it just be i don't see the damage to the head? could it be cuz i only torqued it to 78 ft/lbs? anywho, here's some pics we took, some are not for the faint, but just thought id share how we get when we work on the ol dsm!!!

pic of the car
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...f/fa880014.jpg

arps taste like chicken
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...7/fa8802c2.jpg

pistons
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...3/fa8802bd.jpg

head i thought was jacked up
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...0/fa88001e.jpg

got head?
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...5/fa8802b8.jpg

nipple stimulators
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/...2/fa880020.jpg

Sounds like fun guys, If timing was way off it would let air out of the cyl. but then your valves would be hitting the pistons...

I dont know what the problem could be. I would put it back togeter and MAKE sure timing is correct at all marks... then take another test. If its 0 then get a new guage... and start her up :)

but the gauge worked for one of the cylinders. if it worked for that one, why would it not work for the others? and no way was timing way off, who knows, sumhow maybe it might have maybe almost been sorta 1 tooth off sumwhere maybe. but not WAY OFF, no way. I dunno, im just gunna wait for the new head to come, and put that on, and see what happens there. ill let ya guys know what happens

You wouldn't nessarily see the valves being bad from a visual inspection of the bottom of the head.

ok well we got the other head on, the car works fine now, one cylinder has pretty low compression, but it works for now so im happy, ill just slowly build up the other head to replace the other one, and hopefully some 2g pistons and rings in there too. PROBLEM SOLVED!!!!!! only thing is i have idle surge, but ill work on that some other time, anyone have any ideas what it might be? ISC motor? vacuum leak?

Just curious what you mean by "using oil". Are you putting oil on the threads and then torqueing it down? Just wondering how much room from the end of the bolt to the bottom of the threaded hole. The reason why I ask is, would there be a possibility of cracking the block with oil in the holes? We run into this problem at work from time to time when someone spins a bolt in when there is some liquid in the hole. Oil is non-compressable.

I'm not trying to call you dumb or anything like that, Steve, I'm just trying to get an understanding about it. Any info I can get now will help when I need to rebuild mine. I always crave knowledge, but I like to know reasons as well so I know I'm doing the right thing.

Thanks.