Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

The headgasket is cheap enough where I wouldn't even bother re-using. Yes its more money "down the drain" but like you said peace of mind goes a long long way. And I need every bit of that for my car as I almost hate driving it with how nervous I get about it breaking.

The headstuds could maybe be re-used I know, but re-torquing them for a 3rd time (i have had these on the last two motors) just seems like too much, especially with how much boost I ran before on the car. I already bought the newer ARP's too so its too late now, but they are the new ones and I was always skeptical of the standard ARP's. I think these are more like the L19's or whatever all the 4G63 guys run.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Reusing headstuds and headgaskets is just asking for a failure. Smart move getting everything new!

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Well MAP should be finishing the head reinstall tomorrow, should be done in the morning I think or early afternoon.

Looks like the car was leaking in several spots. Oil feed to the turbo, banjo fitting to the oil cooler and the timing cover were all leaking. They are making sure the motor is perfectly sealed up before they tell me its done. Feels good to know it will all be fixed when I get it back.

They also changed my tcase and rear diff fluid so now I am pretty much all ready for the summer, just need to keep fiddling with the tune to dial it all in.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Nice, hopefully I'll get to see it on the roads more!

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Well got the car back yesterday. Here is a list of all they fixed/replaced.

Cosworth Headgasket (90mm bore, 1.3mm thick)
New ARP Headstuds (625+ ones)
New revision "beefy" timing chain from Mitsu so no chain stretch
Change Tcase fluid
Change rear diff fluid
Valve cover gasket
Water pump gaskets
Oil Cooler crush washers
Thermostat housing
Oil drain o ring
Front main seal

So lots of fixes for gaskets/seals, should be nice and sealed up now hopefully :)

Last night I drove it to Wisconsin to drop off Knoxville's G8 for his cam, ported head and torque converter install out in the boonies of WI. So after 200miles the car seems to be running pretty good. (Trying to get knoxville to start a build thread here just for fun, they got his motor out so damn fast, I want an LS motor, seems so easy).

I don't know how to get over it but i feel like I always hear sounds and I am not sure if I do or not. I think I need someone else to drive it for a while to see if it sounds normal lol.

Regardless, I did some gopro testing tonight on the car and tried to scale my injectors down for real E85 more. Well the gopro still has dumb loud wind noise, I tried some fabric to cut down noise (aka cut up sock :)) that didn't work. Also I had to let off the throttle at 7500rpms as it is around 13.0 at WOT. No more WOT for me...need retune I thinks.

However, my cruise LTFT is +5% and idle LTFT is +1% so my changes seem to be working :) I am going to be stopping at MAP next week to double check all the leaks are gone.

More to come over the next week or two..I have a lot of work to get it ready for MAP's event, still not sure if I will make it honestly. I am not going unless I am 100% confident the car will run correctly, even if its on a low power tune, I don't need full power to have fun, just working right.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

someone add a tag?

Nice man, you might be at the point where you will never feel confident driving the car I know with one of my old cars I was that way and was glad it was gone even though a year later it was someone's DD and was problem free.

I'll drive it! I'm local and usually home (but doing homework) but I'll take a nice break. Also you should try to have someone else drive the car while you tune if you can it might make it a lot easier on you to spot any little things that could be effecting the tune.

Good luck man 200 mile drive is good progress.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Nice, but as for thinking you hear a noise, yeah I don't think you'll ever get over that. That's how we all are. Wasn't there a video someone posted, specifically aimed towards evo owners about that ("do you smell that? did you hear that?")?

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Sweet! Is the cossie gasket extra thick or something--why it over OEM? Just curious.

Lots of good fixes there, hopefully your leaks are all gone! good wok sir, you now have me worried about my stupid timing chain....something to think about down the road I guess.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

You get over it.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Not me, I'm still the same way.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I will help. :beer:

I think its the build, when I had my old 1g, 2.4 50trim thing I hated that car way too much money I didn't know how to do as much as I know now, but I was scared to do the work to it and would prefer people that knew do the work.

Now everything that I've put together on my last few cars (with help from friends of course), I can drive and enjoy and if I do hear a noise I either:
1) have no clue what it is and pull the fuck over or
2) Know its normal or it's something I have knowledge of and its fine for it make the sound in its current state.

Watching your thread Murlo, I'd say this from my experience if a couple more months go by and you still tighten up your butthole just driving the car around or freak out at every bump and squeak get rid of it. Even if its run perfect the whole time or needed more work.

It get's to a point where its a life lesson and you need to jump ship before you go down with it. A lot of us have been there.

If that's not the case, then fucking fall will be here and the temps and tracks will be in good shape to run some damn good times (if that's what you want to do).

If all else fails remember, what what in the butt. :sex2:

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I can't use OEM even if I wanted to, 90mm bore vs. 86mm :) If I was still a 2.0L I would use the OEM, no reason not to, I had one in my gasket kit anyway. The thicker gasket (1.3mm vs. say a 1.1mm) was simply for extra material for a better seal and to lower compression a tiny bit to offset my head being decked so if anything its lower than 10:1. I don't regret high compression yet, but it just makes me nervous now more than anything to run high boost even though most guys run a ton with the high compression. I'd love to try my car on 32psi and see what it can do and might with real e85.

I didn't do this to fix the timing chain honestly, mine seemed fine, never had issues with that. But since everything was coming off, mind as well fix the shit.

Forgot to mention, MAP suggested part of the problem my car was leaking was excessive crank case pressure. I do have a small catch can, but they said its no where big enough. So I am prolly going to get them to put a bulkhead on the valve cover or an AN fitting of sorts and get a big JMfab catch can to relieve the pressure. They said what I have now is insufficient. That way shit won't leak, so I will prolly do that soon.

They offered to do a custom setup to make it fit nice but they said it would get spendy and I care more about function then form so as long as it works I don't care.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

A vette sounds pretty good right now. I really hope you can drive this all summer with no more shop time. Iam so glad I sold my dsm but I do miss the turbo fun. Sooner tor later you will have to sell this thing. I know modding cars make them less reliable but dam fresh motor build and its leaking oil. Hope you get all the bugs and crap figured out soon so you can drive it and not worry about noises and sgit

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Vette is super tempting, I think its fits what I would use the car for...but this weekend made me realize I want one even more, I have "v8 envy" as Shawn put it lol.

This weekend, we pulled out my buddies 09 G8 GT motor and swapped on ported/polished heads with bigger valves, cleaned up everything like piston tops, installed big ass cam, 3200 stall torque converter and put everything back together.

We pulled the motor to do this...it took two solid days for everything basically, not really hustling or knowing exactly the easiest ways to do shit. It's settled, I need an LS motor, so awesome and easy to work on. It was so easy to get the motor in and out, z06 time I think http://www.evoxforums.com/forums/ima...lies/smile.gif

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Swapped in the stock injectors tonight (thanks yet again Shawn!!), got the tank pretty low on E85...then I got bored waiting for the car to drain further so I filled up with about 5.5gallons of 93 octane then another 6.5 gallons of 93 after that at the station. SO 12ish, so I am guessing 2 gallons or so of E85 still left in the tank when I did this.

This is officially the first time in almost 3 years my car has seen anything but E85, it feels weird lol.

I got these two codes while driving...
p0133

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b252/Murlo26/code.jpg
p0071

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...lo26/code2.jpg
Doubt you can read from the pics, but one is basically system too lean and the other is slow circuit response from the o2 sensor.

So I am guessing both are because the car was running pretty lean? The car struggled to idle until trims got almost maxed and same with cruising, 17ish afr's and the car was struggling, once my trims were maxed at 12.5 the car was running fine and 14-15 afrs.

I am guessing part of this is from the left over e85 leaning everything out a bit. But I am also guessing this is where MAF scaling fun come into play. Thoughts? Codes from swapping fuel?

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

So you put the stock scaling and latency values back in right? Both maps?

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I've only ever had one map for this car, never did an alt MAP.

However looking at the MAP I have the car still has 886 scaling in for the alt injector which is close to my injector scaling on the dw1300's for e70.

But if it was on an alt scaling I would imagine it wouldn't run what so ever with that high of scaling, unless the two scalings interpolating or something crazy lol.

I am guessing the left over e85 (2 gallons) was prolly the big problem and then my MAF scaling could use some work too so it adds some fuel. I am going to get that nuts on for the big dumb MAF then go back to dw1300's then do pump gas tune.

Going to send the dw1300's to dw for test, clean and new orings today as well...just to make sure. I don't trust DW's fully anymore so you can never be too careful. They are out for now so mind as well.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

So today the car was riddled with more codes...

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...26/newcode.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...lo26/code4.jpg

Basically more "system too lean" codes. Lower gears 1-3 tend to be around 17 afrs sometimes dipping to 18ish but once up to speed they get to 14-15 where they should be.

Talking with Clipse my MAF scaling should be on the "rich" side already to compensate for leftover e85. I filled up another 2 gallons today and burned another 1/4 tank today so I can't imagine there is too much for e85 left in there still.

My biggest question is this...now I have had like 4 system too lean codes in the past day which makes sense as I am in fact running leaner, but I have also had two o2 sensor codes...is that from just running lean at cruise?

I am starting to worry I have another fuel issue. How do I check the JEG's fuel filter for the blaqops kit, does it just come apart with a flathead or something? Should I pull my fuel pump assembly too? My double pumper still works as before i switched to 93 oct i went partial boost and my afrs dipped to 10's when the pump kicked on so that has to work.

Not sure what to do right now...but seeing this makes me think something else is amiss as regardless of injector scaling before on e85 and my dw1300's the car still wanted to add fuel at cruise. which is still happening on the stock injectors/93 oct. I know these stock injectors are good so I am looking elsewhere.

I did ship my injectors to DW for a checkup today but like I said I can't imagine problems with two different fuels and different injectors...gotta be something else right?

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

What other fuel system mods do you have? Do you have a fuel pressure gauge? If so what's it reading at idle? If not get one (I have a setup you could borrow/have but you'd need a gauge still). Maybe there's something going on with the blaq-ops kit where it is allowing fuel pressure from pump 1 to bleed off via the wye-that feeds from pump 2 when it is off.....this is one of the reasons I've been so adamant about sticking with a single pump.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

The way the fuel trims, and o2 readings are wandering, Id check the engine grounds to make sure they were installed according to the Factory Service Manual. This issues sound awfully familiar to the issues seen with bad grounds on other vehicles. I know it is a long shot, but it probable given the motor has been in and out of the car several times now.

Shawn

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Blaqops double pumper, 2nd pump turned on by progressive boost controller
DW1300s (normally, stock injectors temporarily).
MAP AFPR kit, with fuel gauge on the rail
stock fuel rail

At idle the fuel pressure is spot on, like 43ish psi. Shane has mentioned that about the wye fitting possibly bleeding fuel off the first pump. I assumed that is why I have always had issues with high rpm stomping on the car as the 2nd pump needed time to overcome fuel coming into it from the 1st pump. When I rolled into the throttle from a low rpm I never had an issue. Shane lowered my 2nd pump turn on boost level I believe last time on the dyno which seemed to almost get rid of all this.

The thing is even with that problem, I wouldn't think I would have an issue like this where the car is always adding fuel at cruise. It almost seems like there is a flow issue somewhere or maybe a bad o2 sensor?

I think I am going to open up the jegs fuel filter and clean it out. Then prolly pull my double pumper and see what everything looks like.
Its not wandering though, its only trying to add fuel and its a lot worse cruising vs. idle. Idle is 5% and cruise is maxed out at 12.5% and still not adding enough. So it gets worse as the car is cruising.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I guess my point was that, you have something in the system saying it is running lean, but it is not running lean, then you have an feedback issue to sort out. If you know the injectors are fine, and your running consistent fuel pressure numbers (has this been verified?), then I don't see how this isn't a sensor issue of some sort.

When the car I was troubleshooting had ground issues the sensor readings were all over the map (o2, MAP, and TPS), this caused a ton of CEL's, but the car ran, OK. At time the idle would die, sometimes surge, sometimes engine ran lean, etc. Spent money on a MAP and o2 sensor that didn't need to replacement, but all the signs said they were failing. As it turns out, just needed to replace the ground wires going to and from the chassis to the engine and all was right with the world, sensor readings made sense and the car ran awesome.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I actually am running lean right now...1-3 gears are like 17 afrs at cruise then when I get going a bit more the AFR's get to where they should be, 14-15.5 area. But the car is struggling to run a bit when its running lean lean. I am not boosting what so ever, this is just running around honda civic style too. It's hard to say whats going on.

The idle fuel pressure has been verified, once the car is in gear not sure as the fuel pressure gauge is in the engine bay. I'd need to get the car on the dyno to know.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Probably not an O2 sensor if both are reading lean. Your fuel trims are maxed out on the positive side right, it can't add any more?

I would guess this is an air metering problem if your fuel pressure at the rail is good. Maybe an air leak pre-turbo but after the air sensor? Have you gone into boost? If it goes super rich under boost you may have a massive air leak somewhere, letting in extra air under vacuum and letting out air under boost.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

12.5% is the max for Long term fuel trims. however you can get more added through short term fuel trim. They add, so if LTFT is 12.5 and STFT is 10 then I get 22.5...not sure on max STFT though.

I found out the lean code comes from a maxed fuel trim, so until I get that resolved it will keep popping up. I am guessing the other codes are tied to the "lean" factor as well because they are new with the pump gas map.

I am going to add 10% MAF tonight to richen it up and see what that does. If that works then its probably a combination of more MAF scaling needed and the fact E85 was still left in there.

I shouldn't have any leaks. We checked for exhaust leaks at MAP like two weeks ago on the lift, didn't see anything. Also we boost leak tested everything at the intake and found one leak that I have since fixed so that should be good. MAP did obviously have a ton of stuff off for the head work they did so I am guessing everything got replaced correctly.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Well with another 10% MAF, almost no change

Idle trims improved, they are almost spot on at 1.5%. However cruise, quickly maxed out at 12.5% and I can't even do partial throttle really without going lean, it quickly maxes out my wideband lean if I try to go more than like 10/15% throttle so something has got to be off...

I did check my fuel filter, even cleaned it off with some brake cleaner, it was pretty clean actually so the problem is else where.

I have two thoughts. One, my AFPR...are the AEM's known to have issues?

The second, my walboro 255 main pump. When my second pump kicks in (before on e85) the car goes stupid rich, like 10.0 AFR's. So it almost seems like my 255 isn't working well. Tempted to almost buy a new one as they are so cheap. I have had it for 3 years, but I am not sure how they fail.

Tomorrow night or saturday morning I will pull my assembly because I guess that could be a problem, maybe loose hose clamp, ripped hose or something strange is wrong is my only other thought.

My fuel system isn't that complicated and it seems to be only at low speeds I have the issue.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

If you have fuel pressure at the rail I don't see how that can be an issue. Can you log fuel pressure while you're driving? Even when my CTS-V had fuel issues, basically half the fuel was bleeding back into the tank and not even making it to the feed line, I could do an easy 30% throttle on E85 on a single Walbro 255 and never drop below 60psi. You would have to be starving almost all of the fuel for you to have part throttle lean issues. Either that or letting 100% of the fuel by the regulator back into the tank, but then you wouldn't be showing any fuel pressure.

Log fuel pressure while cruising. If you have just a gauge on the rail with a 1/8" NPT fitting, get a 6' section of hose with NPT fittings on the end and run the gauge into the car so you can read it. This is what I did to verify my fuel pressure was dropping under high throttle. If it is dropping, it could be the main pump getting very weak, or the regulator giving up and letting everything by.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I have one more thing to try, then checking fuel pressure in the car will be the next step I guess. One more tuning thing that is.

That is a good idea to run the hose into the cabin, thanks bud. Maybe I should just buy a fuel pressure gauge for inside the car..hmmm.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I bought a section of plastic hose with male NPT fittings on both ends, and then a female/female adapter so I could plug in the gauge on the other end. I still have the hose, cost me about $15 to make at Fastenal. If you want, I could mail it to you, should only cost a couple bucks and save you some money (I wont be up there again until mid July). I just have to find it haha, let me know if you want it.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

was just about to post here, see below. I don't think I will need the hose anymore, but I am not out of the woods yet :)

Finally some good news! Well what I consider good news lol. Sad kinda as nothing has changed but I think I know the problem (i think). Thank you to Bryan (razorlab) and Tephra as they both suggested this. Bryan gave me the MAFcalc and MAPcalc addresses and I went logging at lunch.

See the attached csv/zip if you are interested.

Basically, the MAFcalc averaged 19% higher throughout the 30min log. So in essence, if I am reading tephra's 3xMAP table threads correctly, the car was never using the MAFcalcs as they were always higher. So we could richen up the MAF scaling but it won't change anything as its just using the MAPcalc. SO essentially the car is running "speed density" in a way, the way of maxing out MAF scaling so you always look at MAPcalcs.

For those of you not familiar with the X, the X runs both speed density and a MAF based system. And from what Tephra has posted it compares both the calculated loads and takes the lower of the two.

So now that I have seen this I guess we are onto dialing in the MAP tables. I am thinking maybe we should put my ghetto ass stock intake/MAF back on and use stock MAF/injectors and their scaling and get the MAP close to that? Not sure how to dial the tables in honestly but one thing is for sure I need to add % to them. Maybe just do like a 10% across the board to start, not sure.

Stay tuned I guess.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

I must have missed it, but why are you back on stock injectors and tuning on them?

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Trying to scale my MAF using stock injectors and stock injector scaling. The theory is with stock injectors, scaling and some pump gas the only thing to dial in should be the MAF scaling.

Well that is fine and dandy on a 2.0L stock compression motor but my motor the VE has changed enough to where we need to do the MAP tables to it would seem.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

If you want my 2-cents, which you probably don't, but... take this thing to a professional tuner!

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

+ infinity

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Well after like 2 revisions, Jon from HBspeed has my MAP tables infinitely better tuned! The car drives almost stock right now. I am loving it.

So it appears that it wasn't my fuel pump at this point, we will see with a few more revisions, but the trims aren't maxed out anymore, still at 10% which is way way better.

More to come.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

what did he do?

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

Drenas FTW!

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

He modified the MAP tables which are related to the speed density portion of the tune. Also they are similar and/or based on the VE tables. I don't fully understand them myself but that was the main thing he adjusted.

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

good shit. Surprised you don't just take it to get tuned and be done.

Or maybe you and scheidesy can have a get together and knock her out one night?

Re: Dave's Evo X Build/The Life of Dave blog
 

There are very few people that seem to know how to correctly do the MAP tables on the X...Jon at HBspeed is one of them. I trust him and am going to let him dial it in. It's only gotten better with each revision. My trims are already within +/- 5% after 4 revisions. We moved onto higher rpm spots to further dial in the tables.

edit: Jon also has the car comfortably idling at 850rpms as opposed to 1200 I had it when I was playing with it lol. Much quieter.