Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Fueling system died on the way to work and I barely got it into the office parking lot. The 044 in the trunk is making horrible death sounds. I'm going to have to do some parking-lot troubleshooting later today but it appears toast.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Time to start using real brand name pumps rather than these modified/generic knock-offs?

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

I had a Bosch-brand 044 first and it didn't flow enough--it'd immediately overheat if you tried to BAP it. There's a reason that the Weldon was waiting to go in.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Ugh that is horrible news dude. That was the jay racing 044 right? Do they by chance make a submersible version?

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

No, they have the PT342 which is what I'm running in the in-tank. It supposedly flows 340lph like the Aeromotive. I put my ear up to it and it's humming away in the tank. I'll verify flow from it before I swap my Bosch in tonight but it sounds happy.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

As is often the case, the problem was not AT ALL what I thought it was. It turns out that the Jay Racing PT342 is actually a rebadged Aeromotive 340. What's interesting about the Aeromotive? Reverse polarity! It don't pump so good when wired backward. It does make sounds like it is working, however. lol.

I drove all the way to work on the 1/2gal that was in my surge tank.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Ah WTF!

Gonna be doing some wiring tonight then? lol

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

No real harm done since I didn't need a tow, so I'm laughing! lol.

I pulled the hanger and brought it home. I figure I'll go into work early tomorrow and drop the re-wired hanger back in the Evo. My boss was kind enough to give me a ride home to grab the beater.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Wouldn't most of the fuel from the surge tank just pass by the rail and go back into the primary tank via the return line? It seems like it would only take a minute for the external pump to go through the surge tank if the in tank pump wasn't doing anything to fill it.

Come to think of it, my 255 filled a gallon container in about a minute. Under throttle, most (if not all) of that is going to be used, but just cruising maybe 1/20th will be used, which means most of the gas just comes back through the return.

Is your surge tank 1/2 gallon? If so, it would only take about 30 seconds of your in-tank pump not flowing anything to run the surge tank dry, just because the external pump is always going to be flowing a lot, regardless if the motor uses it.

Or am I just high and not thinking clearly? Or maybe you have a return into the surge tank?

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Correct, the engine return goes to the surge tank. Overflow from the surge tank returns to the main tank.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Oh nice, didn't even think of that until after I wrote the post.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Ok that is my big beef with the aeromotive pump, why on earth would they wire it backwards from the product they are directly trying to compete against? Makes ZERO sense!

Glad you figured it out, that is just nuts!

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

The polarity fix got the pump working, of course. The problem is that it has too much flow for the return on the stock hanger and is pressuring the surge tank to ~6psi. This causes it to spring a leak at the 044 pump connection. :(

I think I've seen forum posts about ways to make the return less restrictive. Otherwise I'll need to downgrade that pump to a 255.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Would it be easier to swap in a larger return line? like -6 or -8 or something? What size is it now? Then you could have the extra flow you may need down the road, AND have it not overflow. Either way, glad to hear ya got it working!

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

The line isn't the restriction, it is within the stock hanger. They have a restrictor that creates the venturi effect used to pull fuel over from the other saddle in the tank. It was designed with stock flow in mind. Some people drill it out a bit but it's a little risky because if you drill it out too far then it stops drawing from the other saddle and you run out of gas with the gauge reading 1/4 tank.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Sell and replace with stock, 255, or DW300?

LMK if you need a stock pump.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

We will see. I have a pair of 255 in the Full Blown hanger so I could pull one to test with.

Discussion about increasing the return capacity:
http://www.evoxforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28036

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

It looks like air in the fuel lines is my problem. I purged the surge tank/return and now that's all happy. I snugged up the surge tank fittings so no more leak.

Right now I'm getting no fuel pressure to the rail so I suppose there's air in that line as well. I ran out of lunch hour so I'll have to decide what to do with that later.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Air in the feed line shouldn't matter, if your pump is running it should push those air bubbles out.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Spend quite a few hours experimenting. It certainly appears that the return line for the stock in-tank hanger is too restrictive. I just swapped a regular 255 into the hanger and will give it a try in the morning. The car seems to run fine if I leave the in-tank pump unplugged but everything I tried with it running would result in fuel pressure going to 0 at the motor. I even swapped in the Bosch instead of the Jays 044 and the symptoms were identical.

I hope the 255 works. If not then I'll probably try cutting off the return hose in the hanger to bypass the restrictive return/siphon. Too many people eyeballing my car...leaving it parked in one spot for too long is making me nervous. I need to move that car tomorrow...even if that means running off the surge tank and stopping half-way home to refill it.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Sounda like a big PITA over a deng fuel pump setup. I can't believe that nobody has come up with a solution for those cars yet.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Mine works fine...ya know, when my car works lol.

edit: for going straight :)

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Not sure if BlaqOPs mods the return or not. Gotta keep in mind that an Aeromotive 340 flows over 425lph at low pressures. That single pump flows about the same as a double pump at full honk.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-eng...acing-top.html

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

The other pump on a blaqpops isn't another 255 though, its a mustang gt500 pump or something that flows a lot from what i understand.

Regardless, ya those flow a lot.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

It is ~280lph pump and it is Walbro-brand. I looked it up when I had it. IIRC they scored lower numbers than Buschur in that test.

Buschur doesn't care about anything but going forward, either.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

The one in that test was just two 255's I believe. He brought the bigger pump into the equation for the X because it has the same dual voltage setup as stock I thought. i could be wrong but who knows.

Regardless, I am always amazed at the new/different problems your fuels system has.

Eventually, everyone will be using your testing/knowledge to design X fuel systems, i applaud you.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

I appreciate your positivity. As you can imagine, I find it hard to remain optimistic in times like this.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Trust me, I know what you mean...spending kilobucks on cars over and over gets old, I know.

Look on the bright side, through all this, you have always been able to drive your car.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

I was able to confirm that the hanger return is the problem. The one used thing that I buy (fuel hanger) and it has a problem. Go figure.

Now I'll have to find a source for that black slinky hose in the hanger for the return...they snap on so can only be used once. grr.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Would a rubber fuel hose with hose clamps work?

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

I've heard from people that have tried and they say it invariably kinks up due to the angles. 30r10 isn't cheap either so if there's a source for a new plastic line then that'd be a better way. I have an email off to JRZ Tuning, who was able to get one for someone.

It isn't designed to be hose-clamped back on but I'll eyeball it when I cut it off.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

What's 30R10? I assume that must be ethanol-safe fuel hose?

*edit*
Found it: http://www.gates.com/brochure.cfm?br...ocation_id=541

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Yeah, even the single foot I picked up for Scheides on my discount was $14.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

woot! Home where she belongs. I guess I lucked out on the days that it was out of service...I had nice weather to be outside working on it.

I don't mind having a nice BMW parking next to me now. Door ding odds are greatly diminished. I think that spot is a condo owned by Regions Hospital. Apparently not an intern this time.

http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/a.../homeagain.jpg

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

It's a 3 series, so your chances of getting a door ding probably went up.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Photos don't really do justice for how tiny the filter inside of the return is. It was obstructed with very fine particles...looks like rubber and metallic bits.

http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/a...bstruction.jpg

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Ooh, so maybe just cleaning it out will do the trick eh? Or are you drilling it out too?

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

I'll try it cleaned out first. I had a 255 in my stock hanger when I was STS so it really should work.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Drill baby, drill. :(

Huge improvement but fuel pressure at the engine is elevated by 10psi and at the surge tank by 25psi.

I need to figure out how to remove the return assembly from the hanger. I don't see what's holding it in.

Re: Evo X upgrades
 

Interesting and directly applicable to me. Would have been nicer if they simply told you how to fix it, eh?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BO8sl1_vrE&hd=1