Dealing with boost creep and running lean

[1ViciousGSX]

Originally posted by JET@Nov 1 2003, 07:31 PM
I am suprised noone else caught that he is gapping his plugs to .032. You should gap them to .026-.028. .032 is ok for stock boost, but raising it you must lower the gap.

.032 wouldn't cause boost creep or a lean condition unless it was miss-firing which he didn't indicate.

[Alpine TSi]

Are you lean throughout the entire boosted rpm range or only at the highest rpm?
Like John mentioned from his log and the ones I have, I only get knock under creep. But I also get a low high fuel trim and low O2 outputs all the time.

[john]

Well, you will not be able to change the fuel trims until you get an SAFC. The low o2's show that you are running lean. Not much else. Fixing the boost creep will cure or for sure help your knock problem.

[john]

Originally posted by 92tsiawd84@Nov 2 2003, 12:31 PM
Well, you will not be able to change the fuel trims until you get an SAFC. The low o2's show that you are running lean. Not much else. Fixing the boost creep will cure or for sure help your knock problem.
BTW, o2 values are not signifigant until you hit WOT (100%). Dont worry about o2's until you are at WOT.

[PSI2HI]

Stock O2 sensors are not accurate enough for WOT tuning. Go by Knock, keep it around 10 counts. you want timing to be around 20, but higher is better with the 14B, as long as your engine can handle it.

Get a fuel pump and rewire it ASAP. then you will be able to run that boost safely.

[john]

I dont think that he will be able to run 18-19psi safely if he only gets a fuel pump. He has to control boost before he worries about doing anything else.

[niterydr]

Originally posted by PSI2HI@Nov 2 2003, 01:07 PM
Stock O2 sensors are not accurate enough for WOT tuning. Go by Knock, keep it around 10 counts. you want timing to be around 20, but higher is better with the 14B, as long as your engine can handle it.

Get a fuel pump and rewire it ASAP. then you will be able to run that boost safely.
this isn't always true.
I've seen cars grenade at 3 counts of knock, you just have to know the difference between pinging and 'artifical knock'. Also just 'tuning' by knock isn't important, its nice to look at intake temps, injector duty cycles, o2 voltage, egt readings, a/f ratio, coolent temps, etc... all play a factor in a well tuned car, but since he has nothing to tune with, we won't go any further.
Anywho, most dsm's are safe to run up to 10 counts of knock, due to the fact that all the 'noise' they make, but in his case he is actually detonating from running lean. Please refrain from using blanket statements when it comes to tuning cars, it angers me.
Now alpine, here is what you need to do.
1) fix the boost creep, get it to a more manageable 14-15psi.
2) check for boost leaks, before and after turbo (unmetered air like mike suggested).
That'll get you by relatively cheap.
3) Obtain some form of fuel management, just because you are running '510cc's', since you are on the stock 1g fp which runs 36psi (your injectors are probably rated at 43psi), they are actually smaller than that. Look into a fuel pump, or at least check the voltgage at your fuel pump. Next look into getting some sort of fuel controller, choose your poison. (I prefer s-afc, its plug and play, and fairly easy to learn the basics about).
from there it can go any-which-way, pending if you want reliability or speed, keep us posted.

[1Fst14B]

3 Counts of knock?? where do you mount your knock sensor? Unless you have a crazy sensor, messed up electrical or computer, i dont see that happening, unless you are pushing high HP on the stock motor...then even properly tuned it will grenade.
i ran 12.4's all day with 20-40 counts of (Real) knock, pushing 20 some pounds of boost on the 14B.
Basically , IMO, if you grenade @ 3 counts of knock, you prolly got another problem.

Whats wrong with 18lbs with 510's and a fuel pump?? the car should easily be capable of that.

Adam

[A//// Guy]

20-40 counts of knock = beaten motor... not good....

It all depends on what your willing to risk, I would never keep stepping on the throttle past 8-10 counts of knock as I dont want my engine to blow up.

We'll see whos motor lives longer by using your "knock" theory. My car might be slower but atleast I wont have to rebuild it every weekend.

[john]

Originally posted by 1Fst14B@Nov 4 2003, 06:54 PM

i ran 12.4's all day with 20-40 counts of (Real) knock, pushing 20 some pounds of boost on the 14B.

You could have run quicter then. In my experiences with knock, it seems like I am going no where. Car makes alot of noise but doesn't move.