Intentionally inadequately designed thermostats.

[iceminion]

All these "new world" thermostats suck, they are all the same, I've bought them from all the local parts stores and even from the dealership, they all take forever to heat up, and they never reach operating temperature.

This is bad for longevity of the engine, bad for fuel economy and bad for me.

My first couple DSM's heated up by the end of the block at the coldest parts of the winter, but like everyone I know, I was a fool and replaced a perfectly good thermostat, just to be safe.

Now I hate conspiracy theorys, but..... my CRX HF got about 60 MPG on the freeway (about 48 during the winterblend gas months). Now with the NEW thermostat i get about 37, because the engine maxes out at around 150-170 degrees, not the 210 it needs to be to achieve optimal combustion temperatures. The needle doesn't go up to 50% anymore, it goes up to about 30%-40%. I know trusting analogue temperature sensors isn't exactly scientific, but they are japanese gauges, it doesnt change the fact that there is a visable difference on the gauge between the proper thermostat and these new garbage ones.

same thing for my DSM's they all run colder and they all take FOREVER to heat up.

I know this all sounds wild and crazy to you guys, but I am going to replace my thermostat with a flat plate, there will be adequite circulation from the turbo water bypass to verify that I do not have any bubbles in the coolant after the swap, I will heat cycle the car several times to verify that all the bubbles are out of the coolant chambers.

The data points I am hoping to collect:
Heat/Time graph of standard "new world" thermostats
Heat/Time graph of standard "old world" thermostats
Heat/Time graph of blocked off thermostat

Now, from what I am hearing the heat time graphs should be identical, but I have a sneaking suspicion that the blockoff plate will make the car heat up immediately, im not worried about hot spots because of the above mentioned turbo water bypass, also I have many engines and zero engine failures (of cars that I am allowed to maintain properly), so if I overheat/warp/crack a block I really don't care, this is SCIENCE.

Please if you have any insight into this talk to me, my household has a flock of import cars (toyota/honda/mitsu) they ALL take FOREVER to heat up, and they are all working fine with no leaks and new thermostats, I need to solve this because I want to drive to a friends house but I don't want to start driving my DSM because it takes a good 10 minutes for the car to become comfortable and its 4AM, too loud to let it warm up in the street.

Thank you for your thoughts/criticisms

attached is what I expect to find with further and well documented testing.

EDIT, found someone like-minded: http://www.cadvision.com/blanchas/Ranger/Thermostat.html

[turbotalon1g]

I hope that isn't true because I just bought one for my ranger.

That guy is scary, I have my fan come on at about 1/2 way. I'm really hoping that my new thermostat solves my slow warming up problem but it doesn't sound like it will.

[Febo]

Soooo..... Have you maybe tried a 195* thermostat for your CRX HF, one that is 15* over OE recommendations? It won't get you the coveted 210* operating temp, but it should move that needle of yours a bit higher.

Also, where do you get the 210* optimal combustion temp?

Also, are you using fail-safe thermostats, or the ones that if they fail they fail in the closed position?

What brand are you using? Is it a quality brand? What is the ambient temperature of where you are driving? What is the ambient temperature of where you are letting your car idle? What is your radiators efficiency?

The questions can go on and on, but I assume the biggest difference here is the design of the thermostat as older ones will fail closed and blow up your car while new ones fail open and make your car cold.

If you ARE going to do this scientifically then you need to use the same car, same coolant mix, same ambient temperature, same humidity, same A/F ratio, etc.

Good luck.

[FattyBoomBatty]

A possible option for you:
http://www.starquestclub.com/forum/uploads/1293899617/med_gallery_3386_777_72449.jpg

I bought a SMIM with no thermostat housing, so I bought this inline one from Meziere. It uses a standard chevy small block thermostat. I bought a 195 degree stat and it heats up VERY quickly. Much much faster than my kia, which I daily, and wish it heated up faster than 10 minutes of driving or 20-25 minutes of idling.